D&D 5E Chill touch vs Troll regeneration

[Cap'n Kobold]

That mere cantrips can utterly shut down signature abilities of iconic monsters is obviously cheapening the experience.

I do not think anyone disagrees with that.

I'd have to not only disagree myself, but also suggest that most people are OK with specific cantrips shutting down Troll regeneration and similar.

 

[Satyrn]

I'd have to not only disagree myself, but also suggest that most people are OK with specific cantrips shutting down Troll regeneration and similar.

Arrrr! I's agree wit's ya, Cap'n. We should hold a poll and see just how many of us disagree with the Capn.

 

[Yunru]

Arrrr! I's agree wit's ya, Cap'n. We should hold a poll and see just how many of us disagree with the Capn.

Two captains going at it? We'd need some sort of naval rulebook...

 

[Yardiff]

I agree that cantrips for 5e shutting down regeneration is fine. I disagree that there should be one cantrip that does it. Don't have Acid Splash or Firebolt? Time to get creative about shutting down the Trolls regen.

 

[5ekyu]

I think you are having difficulty differentiating "Game Mechanics" and "Lore".

Nevertheless, it makes little practical difference, since you can subdue the troll with Chill Touch then kill it with a torch.

Unless you want to be really pedantic, and insist that since torches have no damage listed, they are ineffective against troll regeneration in 5e.

When asked why you would make a g8ven,mechanics ruling, you said for,lore purposes and referenced "knowing" pickled troll bits in a jar could regenerate back.

Can you point me to a 5e reference where that is stated or a 5e rule which makes that possible?

If not *you* are mixing lore and rules cross-editions, which is fine, if one wants that.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

When asked why you would make a g8ven,mechanics ruling, you said for,lore purposes and referenced "knowing" pickled troll bits in a jar could regenerate back.

Can you point me to a 5e reference where that is stated or a 5e rule which makes that possible?

If not *you* are mixing lore and rules cross-editions, which is fine, if one wants that.

There is no rule in 5e. But there was no rule for it in any other edition either, other than the Rule of Cool. It's just something that happens because it's D&D, like dragons being able to fly.

 

[Stalker0]

That mere cantrips can utterly shut down signature abilities of iconic monsters is obviously cheapening the experience.

I do not think anyone disagrees with that.

Cantrips whose sole purpose is to shut down effects like regen....shutting down effects like regen....yeah I have no problems with that.

 

[5ekyu]

There is no rule in 5e. But there was no rule for it in any other edition either, other than the Rule of Cool. It's just something that happens because it's D&D, like dragons being able to fly.

No rule in prior editions either and no rule in 5e and dragons flying?

Was this a 4e thing?

Cus...

i was pretty sure that in 1-2-3e editions (some at least) there were rules that said:
Dragons can fly.
Trolls regenerate until they were finished with fire (do not recall acid frankly.)

So, that covers there were rules for those in prior editions that did not require rules of awesome cool nifty blah blah blah.

Similarly, i am pretty sure that in 5e there are rules for:
Dragons can fly
Trolls regenerate but this is stopped for a start of a turn if they took acid or fire damage and only die if they start at 0 without regen. Also rule for Chill touch to stop the regen too for its duration. Also rules for severed parts/pieces and when they die.

Now these are different a tad from previous editions, establishing their own structure and mechanical results - but yep there are rules for these in 5e... again no rule of cool, nifty, blah blah needed.

Obviously, GM can add rules or change rules etc and put on there "i am so friggin' cool" hats all the times they want as long as they have players that agree... but that doesn't make claims about lacks of rules and lore or rules confusion any more of a thing.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

No rule in prior editions either and no rule in 5e and dragons flying?

Was this a 4e thing?

Cus...

i was pretty sure that in 1-2-3e editions (some at least) there were rules that said:
Dragons can fly.
Trolls regenerate until they were finished with fire (do not recall acid frankly.)

So, that covers there were rules for those in prior editions that did not require rules of awesome cool nifty blah blah blah.

Similarly, i am pretty sure that in 5e there are rules for:
Dragons can fly
Trolls regenerate but this is stopped for a start of a turn if they took acid or fire damage and only die if they start at 0 without regen. Also rule for Chill touch to stop the regen too for its duration. Also rules for severed parts/pieces and when they die.

Now these are different a tad from previous editions, establishing their own structure and mechanical results - but yep there are rules for these in 5e... again no rule of cool, nifty, blah blah needed.

Obviously, GM can add rules or change rules etc and put on there "i am so friggin' cool" hats all the times they want as long as they have players that agree... but that doesn't make claims about lacks of rules and lore or rules confusion any more of a thing.

Read the section on trolls in MToF. These non-standard trolls are described as being formed from regular trolls by various means. Now read the game mechanics for trolls in the MM. There is no game mechanic for it to become any of those trolls. The game is more than simple game mechanics designed to resolve combat encounters.

Also consider this: my DM has only ever played 5e. Yet we had a version of the "troll regenerating from a scrap of flesh" trope a couple of months ago. He didn't get it from me. It's a standard D&D trope that is not connected to any particular edition.

 

[5ekyu]

Read the section on trolls in MToF. These non-standard trolls are described as being formed from regular trolls by various means. Now read the game mechanics for trolls in the MM. There is no game mechanic for it to become any of those trolls. The game is more than simple game mechanics designed to resolve combat encounters.

Also consider this: my DM has only ever played 5e. Yet we had a version of the "troll regenerating from a scrap of flesh" trope a couple of months ago. He didn't get it from me. It's a standard D&D trope that is not connected to any particular edition.

Of course MToF has other trolls. Nobody says there is only one true troll. There is a world of monstrous possibilities out there for any GM in any game.

No idea why you thought that was ever a question?

That doesnt however require that one change how the "troll" as presented in the MM or the spell Chill Touch need to be changed to accommodate this.

As for your GM, I find it amazing that you seem to believe they got the regen from bits from 5e. Is it so outlandish to believe they might think it up on their own? Is it so unthinkable that they got an idea from any of the many books, movies, games with regenerating creatures where parts of the whole grew and thought "hey, this is cool and I can use it in DnD."

Are you so sure this is a DnD trope he got from 5e when I can recall Reptilicus in the way-before-and-dnd days where the key risk was blowing it up then pieces regen into hundreds - cue creepy claw regen scene at "The End?"

But hey, look, my bet is that if you just give your GM some credit now and again you will see it as not just repeating "tropes" and may be will actually surprise you - thinking up stuff all on their own.