D&D 5E Players: Why Do You Want to Roll a d20?

[Seramus]

No, it's not about simply adding narration. That's the misconception that we can't seem to dispel.

Adding narration almost always creates approach, and sometimes clarifies the goal. The approach will usually give the DM what they need to adjudicate the situation a majority of the time, and if narration provides the goal then it dramatically helps to avoid misunderstandings.

It would be nice if more players included goal in their narration, of course. That’s the one that tends to get left out as often as not.

 

[iserith]

Right. There are 5 or 6 people at the table each with their own perspective as to the imaginary world and the characters and events within it that is being examined at the given moment. That is a recipe for people frequently not being on the same page. Adequate description of the environment by the DM and a reasonably specific yet succinct description by the players for what their characters do makes it easier to ensure we're all in agreement about the circumstances and what's going on. If the players just assume what's in the environment or the DM assumes what the characters are doing, we risk running into problems.

 

[FrogReaver]

I’m on @Hussar’s side on this. I don’t take it as far as he does but

It seems to me that a simple statement like

I try to recall any important information I’ve encountered in my life about the creature I am facing.

There, you have a goal and an approach. That Hussar and I shorthand that to DM do i know anything about this creature shouldn’t be an issue. The goal and approach is implicit. What’s so hard to understand about some actions having implicit goals or approaches.

 

[iserith]

I’m on @Hussar’s side on this. I don’t take it as far as he does but

It seems to me that a simple statement like

I try to recall any important information I’ve encountered in my life about the creature I am facing.

There, you have a goal and an approach. That Hussar and I shorthand that to DM do i know anything about this creature shouldn’t be an issue. The goal and approach is implicit. What’s so hard to understand about some actions having implicit goals or approaches.

I'll pose some similar questions to you that I posed to Hussar:

Can you think of any benefits that might accrue to the players or the play experience as a whole by players describing what experience their characters may have had with the lore the character is trying to recall?

In other words, instead of seeing this as an inconvenience or imposition on the player, what kind of opportunity does it represent?

That seems like a more positive way of thinking about it to me and I'm interested to hear your answer.

 

[Guest 6801328]

I’m on @Hussar’s side on this. I don’t take it as far as he does but

It seems to me that a simple statement like

I try to recall any important information I’ve encountered in my life about the creature I am facing.

There, you have a goal and an approach. That Hussar and I shorthand that to DM do i know anything about this creature shouldn’t be an issue. The goal and approach is implicit. What’s so hard to understand about some actions having implicit goals or approaches.

You're right, that is goal and approach.

Now, the question is, what's the DM going to do with that? He/she may think it's pretty unlikely and just tell you "Nope, you never encountered anything relevant."

If, on the other hand, you tie in your background, and come up with a goal and approach that is either a) more specific, or b) more likely to trigger the Rule of Cool, maybe he/she will either ask for a roll or just give you an auto-success.

It's just like the search for secret doors: if you just say, "Do I notice anything?" the DM might say no. But actually lift the rug and look underneath, and you may get an autosuccess.

Again, you may not want to give DMs this much power. And you may not want to take on this much responsibility. Or maybe you think of this as "player skill" not "character skill." Fine, play with other people who are perfectly happy with "I make a Perception/History/Whatever roll." That works. It really does.

It's just a different way of playing, with a different feel.

 

[Guest 6801328]

Adding narration almost always creates approach, and sometimes clarifies the goal. The approach will usually give the DM what they need to adjudicate the situation a majority of the time, and if narration provides the goal then it dramatically helps to avoid misunderstandings.

It would be nice if more players included goal in their narration, of course. That’s the one that tends to get left out as often as not.

It's possible I misunderstood what you were saying. Usually when people invoke attacking with a weapon as an example it's because they don't understand goal and approach and think it's just about adding narrative ribbons, without actually providing information.

 

[5ekyu]

But, you are so quick to correct my misunderstandings. I'm rather baffled why this gets left on the table.



SERIOUSLY?!?!?!

"I make a History Check" is off limits, but this is fine? Good grief.

This is why this discussion is so frustrating. It's like punching smoke. If "I make a history check" is not an action", then how the heck is THIS an action? And you wonder why the criticism of magic wording gets trotted out so often. "Oh, Mr. DM, I didn't actually SAY history check, so, I guess it's ok?"

Yeah. This is just going around in circles. You've created this mythical play style that actually isn't anything new or original, just wrapped it up in some flowery language in the pretense that it is something different. Complete and utter smoke and mirrors trying to dress up "role playing".

((Clicks unfollow on the thread to more easily ignore it))

Yes

"It's like punching smoke. "

 

[DEFCON 1]

As I said, I'd likely have no issue at your table by the sounds of it.

Well, at least until you tried to grab the Monster Manual to look up relevant information on Flumphs because you thought your PC should know about them... and I told you to put the book away and instead make an INT (Arcana) check to recall the information. And then I'd give you the answers you sought depending on your check.

 

[iserith]

Well, at least until you tried to grab the Monster Manual to look up relevant information on Flumphs because you thought your PC should know about them... and I told you to put the book away and instead make an INT (Arcana) check to recall the information. And then I'd give you the answers you sought depending on your check.

What makes you think that I would look them up in the Monster Manual? Why wouldn't you assume I'd do exactly as I said and just describe what I want to do?

 

[Seramus]

Well, at least until you tried to grab the Monster Manual to look up relevant information on Flumphs because you thought your PC should know about them... and I told you to put the book away and instead make an INT (Arcana) check to recall the information. And then I'd give you the answers you sought depending on your check.

Why assume an otherwise polite guest is going to completely ignore the social contracts and expectations of your personal table and do whatever they want?