D&D General Why defend railroading?

[Paul Farquhar]

Telling the players how to play (as per your above "I want you guys to do (semi-)heroic things" example) is in my view just as bad as the other forms of railroading we've seen posited here.

Ideally, you set this up in session zero. I've run campaigns with both heroic and criminal PCs. But you need to make sure the DM and the PCs are on the same page from the start. I could easily see "lets rob the store" leading to PvP combat with a more law abiding player character. Have you considered how you are going to deal with that?

Of course, knowing to do this stuff comes with experience. And I guess having reasonable expectations for what a DM is able to do does too.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Why not?

Just because they're not engaging with your setting in the manner you desire doesn't mean they're not engaging with it at all - quite the contrary, in this case. Here, they're fully engaged, only in a different and unexpected-by-you way: they've thrown you a curveball and I see it as being your-as-DM's duty to hit it by neutrally and fairly determinning the outcome of their actions just like you would any other actions they might undertake.

Because (unless you are paying them) the DM is doing you a favour.

 

[Lanefan]

Ideally, you set this up in session zero. I've run campaigns with both heroic and criminal PCs. But you need to make sure the DM and the PCs are on the same page from the start. I could easily see "lets rob the store" leading to PvP combat with a more law abiding player character. Have you considered how you are going to deal with that?

Yes. I let it play out however it plays out, and act as neutral referee. They want to kill each other? Fine with me.

Session zero (or, more accurately, session -1 as this happens individually before session 0 which is roll-up night) consists of me outlining the rules system, telling them a bit about the setting, then saying words that boil down to "Here's the setting, do what you want with it and, within the playable race-class limits of the campaign, play what you want. You in?"

 

[Lanefan]

Because (unless you are paying them) the DM is doing you a favour.

The DM is doing me-as-player a favour? As both player and DM, I don't see it that way.

If anything, it's slightly the other way around: the players are doing the DM a favour by showing up every week to play in her game and, collectively, that outweighs any favour the DM is doing by running the game.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Yes. I let it play out however it plays out, and act as neutral referee. They want to kill each other? Fine with me.

Which is fine, if that is the kind of thing you enjoy.

But not everyone wants to play like that, even if the DM has the skill. I doubt I would enjoy being a player in your game. My fantasy is to be a world saving hero, not some squabbling two bit crook.

 

[Lanefan]

But not everyone wants to play like that, even if the DM has the skill. I doubt I would enjoy being a player in your game. My fantasy is to be a world saving hero, not some squabbling two bit crook.

Why not be both?

Failing that, why not at least let the other players be one, or the other, or both?

 

[Paul Farquhar]

The DM is doing me-as-player a favour? As both player and DM, I don't see it that way.

Given the world shortage of DMs, you are in a minority.

Certainly, I would love to be a player, but since no one else will do it, my only choices are to be the DM or not play at all.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Why not be both?

Because I don't like crooks.

Failing that, why not at least let the other players be one, or the other, or both?

Because D&D is a co-op game. You fight and kill each other the end is a short and unenjoyable game.

 

[Don Durito]

Thing is with things like robbing shopkeepers, it's not just the GM's fun that is at stake. It's potentially destructive of the other players fun too.

Of course there's better ways to handle that situation then railroading. But it isn't necessarily something the GM should just be a neutral arbiter of either.

 

[Lanefan]

Given the world shortage of DMs, you are in a minority.

Certainly, I would love to be a player, but since no one else will do it, my only choices are to be the DM or not play at all.

Interesting.

Here the biggest shortage is nights of the week for people to run their games on because nearly all of us are either playing or running another game as well. In our extended crew right now there's 6 different games/campaigns being run by 5 different DMs* and once covid restrictions lift there will probably be a few more.

* - I'm uncertain about whether another is still going or has shut down - might be 7 and 6.