D&D General If you had to split up Dexterity...

[Cadence]

Dexterity annoys me sometimes. Outside of D&D - Why would the quickest draw be the most accurate shot? Why should the surgeon with great hands be a great acrobat? etc... For example, 2e for Skills and Powers split Dexterity into Aim and Balance.

If you had to split Dexterity into two substats, how would you break these up in terms of theme cohesiveness (not necessarily usefulness balance)?

Acrobatics
Armor Class
Climb Walls
Disable Device
Dodge
Escape Artist
Initiative
Movement Rate
Parry
Sleight of Hand
Stealth
To Hit Melee
To Hit Missile

Thanks for any thoughts!

 

[DEFCON 1]

Grand physical movement and hand-eye coordination / reaction. So...

PHYSICAL
Acrobatics
Armor Class
Climb Walls
Dodge
Movement Rate
Stealth
To Hit Melee

HAND-EYE
Disable Device
Escape Artist
Initiative
Parry
Sleight of Hand
To Hit Missile

 

[payn]

This seems to be looking for a level of nuance that I don't need from attribute stats. However, if you were to simplify a skills system into stats then it might be more important. I can play along in that case.

Agility:
Quickness
limber
Reactive

Adroitness:
Slight of hand
Skillfulness
Adeptness

Agility for physical stuff, and adroitness for skill stuff. Not perfect but seems to separate things nicely.

 

[Cadence]

This seems to be looking for a level of nuance that I don't need from attribute stats. However, if you were to simplify a skills system into stats then it might be more important. I can play along in that case.

Agility:
Quickness
limber
Reactive

Adroitness:
Slight of hand
Skillfulness
Adeptness

Agility for physical stuff, and adroitness for skill stuff. Not perfect but seems to separate things nicely.

I have some things about Dexterity that bother me. But every time I try to break them up I start thinking of other ways to divide them, and...

Anyway, I thought it would be easier to just get more opinions. I haven't decided if I'll ever split them up for homebrew stuff, but I figure I'll stop even considering it if it looks like their isn't a good split.

Thank you for your input!

 

[DND_Reborn]

I would separate them into your ability to control/manipulate your own body and your ability to interact with objects.

Control/manipulate your own body:

Acrobatics
Armor Class
Climb Walls
Dodge
Movement Rate
Stealth

Interact with objects:

Disable Device
Parry
Sleight of Hand
To Hit Melee
To Hit Missile

Call them what you will.

Initiative I would not link to Dexterity, but allow it to go to Intelligence or Wisdom to prevent those from being dump stats for martials.

FWIW, Dexterity has for a long time been too useful, and d20 D&D made it worse than ever IMO.

 

[Yaarel]

These work as either eight abilities or four abilities.

• Strength-Constitution
• Athletics-Dexterity

• Intelligence-Perception
• Charisma-Wisdom

Athletics is mobility, including all of the Athletics checks and Acrobatics, as well as speed and the AC bonus. Finesse weapons are here.

Dexterity is precision, including manual-dexterity Slight-of-Hand and Stealth. Aiming weapons (bows, guns) are here.

 

[Retreater]

Warhammer Fantasy splits it into Ballistic Skill, Agility (full body movement), Dexterity (fine motor skills), and a separate Initiative characteristic. While I think that's too much for D&D, I think Agility and Dexterity could be an okay distinction. Or just putting different levels of proficiency in related skills.

 

[Cadence]

These work as either eight abilities or four abilities.

• Strength-Constitution
• Athletics-Dexterity

• Intelligence-Perception
• Charisma-Wisdom

Athletics is mobility, including all of the Athletics checks and Acrobatics, as well as speed and the AC bonus. Finesse weapons are here.

Dexterity is precision, including manual-dexterity Slight-of-Hand and Stealth. Aiming weapons (bows, guns) are here.

That's along the lines of what I'm thinking (might rename Intelligence and Wisdom), but splitting the Dexterity always has me second guessing. Thanks for the feedback!

 

[Mezuka]

The problem you have with dexterity is fixed in Fantasy AGE. It's divided in three.

• Dexterity, for dextrous things, agility and coordination.
• Accuracy, to hit with range attacks or finesse weapons.
• Perception, to do more damage.

It works well. You can have a character who is good at fixing things but can't shoot a bow properly to defend himself.

 

[Helldritch]

One way to go at it.
Reflex:" AC, Save and Accrobatics."
Precision:" To hit with projectile and finesse, skills that requires hand eye coordination such as pick locks, sleight of hand"

Initiative should always go with wisdom or intelligence.
Strength penalties should always apply to melee weapons, finesse or not.