D&D 5E Warlords of Krynn and the 4e class name in it...

[Lyxen]

"Come back from the light... we still need you" I don't see where a hero getting up (spend a healing surge heal and then take your action) is really in the need of magic. We watch Rocky, Hulk Hogan and many other 'realistic' performances come back from almost dead...

They are not dying. They don't have fatal wounds. And while a fighter might use his own reserves (see second wind below), healing another's fatal wounds is another story.

okay but unserstand that many of us see NO PROBLEM with non magic healing...

Yeah, right, "many"... And I think that many MORE have a problem with it.

by the way how do you handle Fighter Second Wind?

That's fine, it's personal, and it does not work if the fighter is really dying.

 

[James Gasik]

Anyways, it's an easy patch. You don't need magic to give people temporary hit points, so the Warlord can hand out temporary hit points instead. Nobody has their fantasy challenged.

 

[Lyxen]

Anyways, it's an easy patch. You don't need magic to give people temporary hit points, so the Warlord can hand out temporary hit points instead. Nobody has their fantasy challenged.

As mentioned, I played a Warlord (although I preferred my Swordmage) and enjoyed it, and I would welcome a more "commander-type" class, with the restrictions that honestly I don't see how it applies to undisciplined other PCs and how that makes one a "warlord". But the fact is that it worked well with 4e with the extremely tactical (but, to me, very artificial) combat, 5e has moved to a more abstract and narrative combat, and all the push/pull/slide abilities work much less well in Theater of the Mind.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

As mentioned, I played a Warlord (although I preferred my Swordmage) and enjoyed it

can I just say they were my favorite PCs, I had played 2 warlords and 3 swordmages over the 10 years we played

 

[James Gasik]

I really liked having a Warlord around, although I rarely played them myself. I preferred the Bard and the Cleric as Leaders personally.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Yes, through magic.

My problem is not a specific class having healing powers, it's using a power source which is specifically not magical to heal.

Why though? It's not like real wounds are dealt with HP damage. HP is something that you can recover with at most some bandaids/ointments.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Because only 4e has that specific note, and it's only a part of the HP.



Wrong, if it's the last ones that you have, it's not only debilitating but potentially fatal. And that's where the problem lies with healing those without magic.



How about "Dying" ? Because that is what happens when you are at 0 HP. How are you going to shout that one back at full capacity without magic ?



Magic. Once more, my problem is not classes having healing powers, it's classes based on specifically non-magical power sources doing that.



And I don't agree with that, HP perfectly simulate the "nonsense" of the genre.



Not enough information. Did Bob have 100 hp or 3 HP before being stuck ?



sigh He was not even a fighter anyway...

Amy strikes Bob for 5 HP of damage with her longsword.
Carl casts Healing Word and Bob regains 3 HP.

You can't "realistically" narrate this exchange even knowing the starting HP because HP don't actually MEAN anything, despite the insistence that this very gamist thing TOTALLY means meat. A HP is a HP is a HP. If you're describing them as life ending wounds, even at low HP, then that's your own fault. You don't get over a gut stab in an hour with some bandaids, or overnight. Your self-imposed lack of suspension of disbelief isn't a warlord design problem when you willingly buy into the other forms of HP stupidity.

D&D is trash at simulation. It doesnt matter if Bob has 100 hp or 1. Why do the gods like 1HP Bob more? I mean, surely that 5 damage on a 1 HP guy is a total evisceration. Why can a potion of healing put a 4 HP guy's guts back in, and dont even fix a 100 HP guy's scratches? Why is the guy with his guts ripped out not suffering from trauma and shock?

The only way HP work is through Schrodinger's Wounds, where they aren't anything until the critter actually dies.

 

[James Gasik]

Amy strikes Bob for 5 HP of damage with her longsword.
Carl casts Healing Word and Bob regains 3 HP.

You can't because HP don't actually MEAN anything, despite the insistence that this very gamist thing TOTALLY means meat. A HP is a HP is a HP. If you're describing them as life ending wounds, even at low HP, then that's your own fault. You don't get over a gut stab in an hour with some bandaids, or overnight. Your self-imposed lack of suspension of disbelief isn't a warlord design problem when you willingly buy into the other forms of HP stupidity.

D&D is trash at simulation. It doesnt matter if Bob has 100 hp or 1. Why do the gods like 1HP Bob more? I mean, surely that 5 damage on a 1 HP guy is a total evisceration. Why can a potion of healing put a 4 HP guy's guts back in, and dont even fix a 100 HP guy's scratches? Why is the guy with his guts ripped out not suffering from trauma and shock?

The only way HP work is through Schrodinger's Wounds, where they aren't anything until the critter actually dies.

Personally, I apply the concept of Bloodied here. Damage up to half your maximum hit points is just you juking and jiving and minimizing damage taken through all the factors hit points are stated to encompass.

Beyond that, I start describing actual cuts, scrapes, and wounds. But in heroic fiction, even a very wounded person can find the resolve to continue moving despite their wounds, or even seem to fall unconscious and revive. If someone doesn't like non-magical healing, you can just hand out lots of temporary hit points (even Inspiring Leader allows this).

Or require the use of a Healer's Kit (another non-magical way one can be healed thanks to a Feat). Or say you can't heal hit points below 50%.

I personally think the fiction totally allows for effective non-magical healing, but if people don't like it, they don't like it, even though you can point to rapid recovery times from resting as already being beyond reasonable.

 

[bedir than]

Isn't the game Warriors of Krynn?

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

I guess, if some reaaaaallllly dont care for non-magical healing, that the Marshal could focus more on AC/Saves buffs, conditions resistance and action-economy/initiative shenanigans, with a nice dose of THPs and increased max HP (ala Aid). Even things like auto-stabilization from Spare the Dying could be on the table, or at least advantage on death saves in an aura.

Its not like the meager healing of Inspiring Word was the the raison d'être of the Warlord in 4e. In fact, the class was rather weak on direct healing, both surge-fueled or surge-less.