Star Wars: Andor

[Celebrim]

I feel bad for the Obi-Wan crew. Andor far eclipses it.

Excepting Rogue One, until now everything Disney has done with the Star Wars IP has felt like an afterschool 1980's cartoon. Sometimes, as in about 5 episodes of The Mandalorian, it felt like a really well done cartoon. But it still felt like a cartoon.

This to me feels like the first real adult drama since I watch the original trilogy back in the theaters. It's dark, but it's not gratuitous. It's not dark because it loves the darkness, but because it hates it. It's brilliantly written human characters that feel real, not like members of Superfriends playing games with laser swords and killing off faceless mooks to provide the viewers vicarious egotistical power thrills.

You actually pity the bad guys because the bad guys are also just humans trapped in the system. The guards huddled in the closet hoping they wouldn't be noticed, you didn't hope they died. They surely weren't all sadists. So much of the time Star Wars is offering up violence without cost, war without sacrifice, and in the Disney era, fights whose only purpose is pure spectacle. Like think how many fights in The Mandalorian involve some nameless group of thugs whose sole purpose is to die for our enjoyment in a visually compelling but meaningless conflict that doesn't advance the story.

People are dying in Andor, but it isn't for our enjoyment.

 

[pukunui]

Yeah, that was a thrilling episode.

I’ll have to listen to Luthen’s speech again because I did not pick up on any hints that he might be Force sensitive let alone an ex-Jedi.

Sounds like Cassian’s mother is refusing to take her medicine. Cinta overhears as she walks past, then the camera lingers on some unknown guy who’s lurking nearby. A disguised Imperial agent keeping an eye on Cassian’s mom in case Cassian shows up?

I would’ve thought Mon would be happy to get rid of her daughter, given how awful she is to her. But I guess she really does love her anyway and doesn’t want to subject her to the same arranged marriage situation she went through – and certainly doesn’t want to make such a connection with a known gangster. But I suppose in the end she will agree to the arrangement.

 

[embee]

I would’ve thought Mon would be happy to get rid of her daughter, given how awful she is to her. But I guess she really does love her anyway and doesn’t want to subject her to the same arranged marriage situation she went through – and certainly doesn’t want to make such a connection with a known gangster. But I suppose in the end she will agree to the arrangement.

She may not like her daughter but she does love her daughter. And she also likely loves her family's good name.

 

[trappedslider]

He who fights monsters
A rebellion is always legal in the first person, such as "our rebellion." It is only in the third person - "their rebellion" - that it becomes illegal.
One man's freedom fighter is another's terrorist
___
When Serkis said he couldn't swim all I could think was
"Are you crazy? The fall will probably kill ya."

 

[pukunui]

So how will Cassian and Melshi make it off that moon?

Also, the whole thing about sacrificing Kreegyr so the ISB doesn’t catch on that they’ve got a leak reminds me of how the Allies in WW2 had to make similar sacrifices in places like Greece and Crete so that the Nazis wouldn’t catch on that their codes had been broken by the enigma device.

 

[Celebrim]

Also, the whole thing about sacrificing Kreegyr so the ISB doesn’t catch on that they’ve got a leak reminds me of how the Allies in WW2 had to make similar sacrifices in places like Greece and Crete so that the Nazis wouldn’t catch on that their codes had been broken by the enigma device.

True, but I think Luthen is lying. I think in episode 12, Saw will show up with his air cover and save the day and Luthen will have subtly altered the plan to account for the trap.

 

[phuong]

Serkis goddamn nails it.

Andor knows tension. It does tense on a level I've not seen in a long time. The bad guys don't twirl mustaches or tie damsels to train tracks. They don't even threaten. The

I am blown away. Just wow. What a combination of acting, writing, execution. Just incredible.

This show delivers a world that reflects a reality, not a childish fantasy, where adults have adult emotions, make tough decisions that have consequences. Its grim and dark, but no gratuitous sex and violence. Everything serves a purpose.

I cannot thank the Disney crew that made this possible. Incredible gem.
I feel I could watch all over again immediately and it is not even finished.

 

[pukunui]

True, but I think Luthen is lying. I think in episode 12, Saw will show up with his air cover and save the day and Luthen will have subtly altered the plan to account for the trap.

I’m not sure how your quote of my post got attributed to trappedslider but anyway, you might be right. We’ll have to wait and see.

Interestingly, the show’s creator has said we’ll find out about Luthen’s past by the end of the series. (Not necessarily this season, though.)

On the topic of Kreegyr, I think it’s a nice detail that he’s a Separatist now fighting as a rebel. One thing SW hasn’t really touched on is what happened to all the Separatist worlds and their people after the end of the Clone Wars. I wouldn’t be surprised if many of the former Separatists joined the Rebel Alliance, especially since the Separatist Confederacy had a high concentration of aliens, and the Empire was very anti-alien.

 

[Celebrim]

On the topic of Kreegyr, I think it’s a nice detail that he’s a Separatist now fighting as a rebel. One thing SW hasn’t really touched on is what happened to all the Separatist worlds and their people after the end of the Clone Wars. I wouldn’t be surprised if many of the former Separatists joined the Rebel Alliance, especially since the Separatist Confederacy had a high concentration of aliens, and the Empire was very anti-alien.

The Separatist Holdouts are a very real and important part of the equation from BBY 18 to BBY 3 when they became overshadowed by the Alliance to Restore the Republic, and I very much agree that is territory that hasn't been explored enough.

Despite being a treacherous scoundrel, Dooku was a charismatic figure with a public philosophical position that was attractive and defensible. Lots of people kept the dream of a Separate outer rim based on a free association of worlds alive after or especially after the corporate backers of the CIS were eliminated by Palpatine. While the Clone Wars officially ended, there were dozens of smaller campaigns in the early years of the Empire to subjugate separatist worlds and leaders that refused to give up their dreams.

What's interesting about trying to fold those separatists into an 'Alliance to Restore the Republic' is that restoring the Republic is sort of the last thing on the Separatists minds. For more than a decade they've been fighting to leave the Republic, then you've got to come along and convince them to join the project, possibly by convincing them that you are joining their project, a new equitable Republic with representation and guaranteed liberties and freedoms for all worlds. It's a very interesting problem, and it's one that Andor has been at least touching on with Saw's speech decrying the politics of all other rebel factions but his own - "Human Cultists!" (apparently in his estimation, restoring the Republic goes with implicitly accepting the High Human Culture ideology that the Empire is built on?) or "Galaxy Partitionists!" (who are outsiders to decide for others were borders and sectors should be drawn?). Saw has the clarity of purpose of a true fanatic, and Luthen is the consumate realist - all ideas get messy in the implementation.

The Star Wars campaign I've been running for the last 2 years is set in BBY 15 so this is all grist for the brain mill for me. I had notes on a lot of these things, but the series is giving me lots of depth and lots of new canon to play with.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I would’ve thought Mon would be happy to get rid of her daughter, given how awful she is to her

Ever met a teenager? If parents didn't keep on loving them despite how awful they are none of us would be here.

Teachers, too, put up with a lot of **** from teenagers and keep on caring.