D&D (2024) Long rests getting better but GM needs still not being considered

[AnotherGuy]

That is a great answer...for the right players. A lot of folks IME only really care about the next adventure, and that sort of stuff wouldn't matter to them.

True. Thankfully 3 or 4 out of my 5 players would care.
The other is your typical murderhobo - he is new to the group and we are busy "training" him to roleplay.

 

[FallenRX]

It's more obviously gamified.

Honestly someone put it to perspective for me recently. Which was basically saying...all of this basically boils down to.
The players doing the rational thing after a serious fight and just watching away, they want to act rationally and we simply do not want them too.

The reality is, after a serious fight, where resources were spent to deal with it quickly, when is it ever rational to not just rest if you can help it to be at your best if you know your going into a dangerous situation, and you can afford too.
The answer is 100% always. Like thats just how it is.

even in real life, after a hard fight people dont go into 5 more, they go rest, because they want to be at their best period when dealing with something possibly dangerous, its never illogical. Wars have been won and lost on this very principal.

The best solution is...a non-mechanical one or a external penalty outside of the characters(like encounters), give them a realistic reason for why they do not have time to rest, and must push on, otherwise, it is 100% always logical to do so, both irl and in game, in every edition.

in Older editions the solution was Dungeon restocking, in the more narrative-driven era its more story consequences.

But the five minute adventuring day issue is just a feature...of like life, people need a reason to risk pushing on, if not its always best to rest and come at it better the next day

 

[GMforPowergamers]

True. Thankfully 3 or 4 out of my 5 players would care.
The other is your typical murderhobo - he is new to the group and we are busy "training" him to roleplay.

Ironically the first time (this is many years and an edition ago) I had a pure RP consequence to a new player everyone was ready for him to not care since he had everybit of murder hoboed up until then... and he was so shocked he didn't know what to do. He was so used to getting just another combat out of it... and he didn't.
Jon is RUNNING a game right now using my tactics against me.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Honestly someone put it to perspective for me recently. Which was basically saying...all of this basically boils down to.
The players doing the rational thing after a serious fight and just watching away, they want to act rationally and we simply do not want them too.

The reality is, after a serious fight, where resources were spent to deal with it quickly, when is it ever rational to not just rest if you can help it to be at your best if you know your going into a dangerous situation, and you can afford too.
The answer is 100% always. Like thats just how it is.

even in real life, after a hard fight people dont go into 5 more, they go rest, because they want to be at their best period when dealing with something possibly dangerous, its never illogical. Wars have been won and lost on this very principal.

Imagine a seal team, they just escaped with there lives from a firefight, they need more ammo and some of them are hurt. They can go lay low in that vetranirians office and get some stolen medical help for there friend, rest and recoup... or they can press on and attack another target... can I imagine a situation where they push on and complete something yes 100% but I can imagine WAY more sceneries where they hunker down... especially if they expect to refill ammo and grenades in 8 hours.

 

[Branduil]

The problem is 99% of dungeon crawls are not SEAL team time-critical missions, you can try to make it so but that's unlikely to be a permanently workable solution.

If you look at how D&D is usually actually played, the best solution is probably to simply make most powers per-encounter. But we saw how that went, so...

 

[mellored]

Probably wouldn't work for DnD.

But you could narrativly justify milestone as gaining power by killing stuff.

Like you get spell slots back by collecting reagents from magical monsters. Clerics need to impress their god with heroic deeds. Warlocks need sacrifices for their power. Or some other excuse where resting doesn't work, but action does.

Would be really easy for a vampire game.

 

[Flamestrike]

except you said the group.

I said to the group at Session zero, 'there will be no 5MWD, any attempt to game it will fail, and this campaign adheres to 6 or so encounters per Long rest'.

'No gaming the rest mechanic in this campaign' was discussed during session zero.

Players buy into that at that stage, or they don't (and take no part in the game). My game, I'm the DM, my rules. Dont play if you dont want to.

Players that then attempt to abuse the 5MWD, find it doesnt work. If they sook about that fact, they don't need to bother 'leaving the table' because they'll be getting thrown out of the game quicker than their heads can spin.

 

[Scott Christian]

While DMing, I have always just followed the story. There are many times the PCs have one fight, blow all their resources, and then long rest. But then, when they come to a place where they know there will be a harder road, they have a tendency to play much more reserved. And there are the times they go through all their resources, only to have a second encounter or exploration piece appear unexpectedly. A mixture of these three things (with the last one not happening often), in my opinion, is the best way to approach it. (To be fair and honest, I am also one of those people that find random monster encounters incredibly lame.)
But the story trumps all. If they have a great camp, Leomund's, an awesome ranger or druid that has hidden them well, etc. that just seems like good playing on their part.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I said to the group at Session zero, 'there will be no 5MWD, any attempt to game it will fail, and this campaign adheres to 6 or so encounters per Long rest'.

'No gaming the rest mechanic in this campaign' was discussed during session zero.

Players buy into that at that stage, or they don't (and take no part in the game). My game, I'm the DM, my rules. Dont play if you dont want to.

Players that then attempt to abuse the 5MWD, find it doesnt work. If they sook about that fact, they don't need to bother 'leaving the table' because they'll be getting thrown out of the game quicker than their heads can spin.

got it, no need to keep going we will NEVER agree

 

[tetrasodium]

got it, no need to keep going we will NEVER agree

I can't tell if you have been citing a personal opinion on the matter or if you've been playing devils advocate to demonstrate the eca t no win group splitting scenario that 5e rests force a gm through when they start trying to put the brakes on the designed in 5mwd. If it's the latter I'd say that you've forgotten a phrase like "they realized the old style was unpopular and shouldn't be used anymore" or "more of us are in favor of these rests than your half baked homebrew rests" and "look at all the infighting you are creating, this is supposed to be a game, try talking to us if you think there is a problem & see what you can do to work out your problem because we need this rest". Of course if it's the former...