D&D 5E Ruling Question on Shapechanger & Hold Person

[aco175]

Question: Let's assume the latter. Is there a way to kill a polymorphed creature without reducing it to 0 HPs and thus breaking the spell? I was trying to figure out a clever way to do this with the exhaustion mechanic but couldn't come up with anything.

Would drowning or suffocating work. I forget if the text says that you drop to 0hp or just die.

The situation is similar to an elf that wildshaped into a bear and got paralysed by ghouls, once back in the form of an elf, they were freed from the effect.

This is another interesting point. Might have to look up wildshape, but to keep with my slaad logic I might have to keep the elf from being affected by the ghoul, but also give the ghoul the knowledge to go after someone else.

 

[Baron Opal II]

I would rule that it would not work, and thus be a clue towards the creature's true identity. It being truly an aberration, the spell fails. It's just squished into a humanoid package.

 

[jmartkdr2]

The two sentences contradict: one says the type changes, the next sentences says it does not.

I'd flip a coin, I think.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

The two sentences contradict: one says the type changes, the next sentences says it does not.

I don't see it saying anywhere "it's type changes". It only says "it's statistics don't change".

 

[jmartkdr2]

I don't see it saying anywhere "it's type changes". It only says "it's statistics don't change".

“The slaad can use its action to polymorph into a small or medium humanoid.”

I’m reading that as “it turns into a humanoid.” If it becomes a humanoid, its type would change. If it doesn’t become a humanoid, it doesn’t turn into a humanoid.

 

[Vaalingrade]

In spirit, the Hold Person spell is there to be great if the DM uses people as foes and absolute garbage if they're using monsters, so no from the spirit of the rules.

In practice, it's terrible enough while playing D&D that I'd throw the poor sot that took the 'slow down one guard' spell a bone.

 

[Lanefan]

I ruled that the hold person does not work. I think the slaad is still an aberration even though the wording says shapechange into a humanoid. I feel the term here refers to something more like a PHB race and not the specific type. I would allow the wizard to know that the spell had no effect and allow some sort of check to determine that the target was not a humanoid.

I'd quibble with the last bit by asking what's the observed-in-fiction difference between "no effect because the target's an aberration" and "no effect because the target made its save"?

 

[Lanefan]

Yes, the way I'd run this, the players could infer from the fact I didn't roll a save for the slaad, but merely stated it was unaffected by the spell, that the slaad is something other than what it seems.

Except to preserve the slaad's cover (and not give info to the players that their characters wouldn't have) I'd still go through the motions of rolling a save and ignore what the die told me.

Situations like this are why I don't usually do DM rolls in the open.

 

[Lanefan]

In spirit, the Hold Person spell is there to be great if the DM uses people as foes and absolute garbage if they're using monsters, so no from the spirit of the rules.

And also there to give the DM a useful arrow in the quiver.

I've seen it used many a time by PCs to rein in other PCs...

 

[cbwjm]

Situations like this are why I don't usually do DM rolls in the open.

Though it would make players wonder what's up if you rolled a 2 out un the open and then announce the spell has no effect. I sometimes think that's more fun than keeping the roll hidden.