D&D (2024) Playtest 6: Bard

[Yaarel]

Eldritch Blast is essential for Warlocks because it's just that much better than any other option.

These new "class spells" no longer participate in the balancing mechanism of spell slot levels. They are intentionally broken.

Any class spell (Bard Vicious Mockery, Warlock Eldritch Blast, Ranger Hunters Mark, etcetera) needs to be removed from the list of spell descriptions and added to the class features descriptions instead.

It is extremely important to balance spells mechanically, especially in order to balance gameplay at the highest tiers and to balance between spell caster classes and non caster classes.

Because class spells are intentionally overpowered because they are borrowing from the class design space, they are no longer participating in the spell design space. It is extremely important to regulate the spell design space.

 

[Yaarel]

Re the Bard Spellcasting feature.

Its Spellcasting Focus is a musical instrument. But the College of Dance would use neither the musical instrument nor the material spell component in this magical context. Other Bard noninstrumental concepts such as singer, orator, or actor would eschew them as well.

Instead, the feature should read something like:

"
Spellcasting Focus. A verbal or somatic component can serve as your Spellcasting Focus for the spells you cast with your Bard features. Alternatively, playing a musical instrument can replace all spell components.

"

 

[Stalker0]

I find it interesting that the Bard always has the option to take Vicious Mockery, and Vicious Mockery is a bard exclusive spell, but they don't get it automatically. I find that strange, and kind of off-putting,

I think they will change it just for the confusion. I guarantee a lot of tables will read that and just assume viscous mockery is an automatic cantrip.

 

[mellored]

Because I generally play casters, the Bardic Inspiration is normally worthless for my characters.

I feel like all classes need to have features like that. Something kind of worthless to themselves, but good for others.

I.e.
Head Trauma. (Barbarian 3)
When you score a critical hit with a 2-handed weapon, the target has Disadvantage on their next wisdom or intelligence saving throw before the start of your next turn.

 

[Incenjucar]

I feel like all classes need to have features like that. Something kind of worthless to themselves, but good for others.

I.e.
Head Trauma. (Barbarian 3)
When you score a critical hit with a 2-handed weapon, the target has Disadvantage on their next wisdom or intelligence saving throw before the start of your next turn.

You can make it a penalty to checks, and now they can still use it for intimidate.

 

[Yaarel]

Something kind of worthless to themselves, but good for others.

The problem is the Bardic Inspiration is worthless to other players who play a caster.

Currently, even the Bard can use Inspiration to make the Bards own sword attack a successful hit.

The problem is becoming worthless to other players. There fails to be "support" here for characters who are casters.

 

[Sulicius]

I already love the 5e 2014 Bard. When this UA becomes the 2024 Bard, I am love it even more.

My only difficulty so far, is the mechanic for the Bardic Inspiration.

Because I generally play casters, the Bardic Inspiration is normally worthless for my characters.

The Bardic Inspiration can only cause "success". It cannot cause failure.

For other players it can mean their sword hits. But for my characters it means nothing. I need the Inspiration to cause the target of my spell to fail its saving throw.

Likewise, the power of both weal and woe − both praise and satire − is a deeply bardic theme. My spellcaster needs to be able to use the Bardic Inspiration to either buff myself or debuff my foe.

Bardic inspiration works on attack rolls, ability checks and saving throws. That is enough because you roll these all the time. It inspires allies. Spellcasters roll ability checks and saving throws too. They even buffed the duration to an hour.

Or maybe you are right. Fireball doesn’t really help my smooth talking wizard. I want it to be able to heal my party too. Maybe I can’t have everything.

Re the Bard Spellcasting feature.

Its Spellcasting Focus is a musical instrument. But the College of Dance would use neither the musical instrument nor the material spell component in this magical context. Other Bard noninstrumental concepts such as singer, orator, or actor would eschew them as well.

Instead, the feature should read something like:

"
Spellcasting Focus. A verbal or somatic component can serve as your Spellcasting Focus for the spells you cast with your Bard features. Alternatively, playing a musical instrument can replace all spell components.

"

We dance to music. It is already fine this way.

 

[Yaarel]

In the recent interview with Crawford, he describes the Bard being like the Pied Piper who leads a swarm of rats while playing a wind instrument. Later he says, the Bard can cast magic silently by signing its words thru dance.

Unfortunately, the obsolete spell component mechanics from AD&D 1e contradict what he is visualizing.

It is probably better for 5e to delete spell components from the spell descriptions. Each class and sometimes subclass has its own method for casting spells.

At least the Bard class needs to clarify its bardic methods for casting spells. The Dancer casts spells by (somatic) dance only. The Poet, Singer, and Storyteller casts spells by (verbal) voice only. The Musician casts spells by playing a (material) musical instrument only.

Only in this way can what Crawford describes become true.

 

[fuindordm]

Giving bards access to all spells in the game? Surprising but... acceptable.
On first glance, as a full spellcaster, this makes them the most powerful spellcaster class. Why play a cleric if you can play a Divine bard? Why play a druid if you can play a Primal bard? Why a wizard if you can play an Arcane bard?
The saving grace is that they remain a "spells known" class while the cleric, druid, and wizard can change their spells every long rest. And by the time the bard gets access to other magical traditions, most of their spells are already locked into the first one, so expanding outward is going to be a slow process.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

In the context of the Bard class, the divine magic should probably focus on the themes of "Fate", rather than the themes of "Holiness" per se.

In this bardic context, uplifting poems of praise can facilitate the Bless spell, while witty poems of satire can Inflict Wounds. Etcetera.

All of the divine spells become more about foreseeing and altering the threads of Fate.

Strongly disagree, the underlying idea of the Divine Bard is one who sings Hymns (or does sacred dances that represent important mythology stories within a religion).