D&D 5E The Illrigger: Why I hate this class and love what it could have been.

[Steampunkette]

the only change i don't like here is "knave". it sounds like an alternative rogue. ironically, i think "varlet" sounds better.

I could do Varlet, maybe? Though its connection to Valet, historically speaking, is really pronounced.

Blackguard would also work, of course, as a callback to the 3e Prestige class without being an explicit update.

Either would definitely be better than a Skamelar (Parasite, Scrounger) or a Churl (one step above a slave in the social ladder).

Y'know. There's options. I mostly just want whatever it is to be a disparagement 'cause I feel that would help unite them, thematically, with the other insult-based classes.

 

[Necropolitan]

The Hellspur is a homebrew Fighter Subclass from the homebrew Thunder Junction Magic: The Gathering supplement and it gave me everything I wanted from a "Hellknight" subclass.

It's got powers relating to fear and fire and doesn't try to make the Fighter a spellcaster (it does give access to a Nightmare mount through Find Greater Steed and the capstone ability is Investiture of Flames though), instead focusing on making them better at damage output and Intimidation.

It's simple, thematic, and doesn't require players to learn an entirely new resource system.

 

[TiQuinn]

It'd make about as much sense, linguistically... "Evil/Sick Rope-Manager/Tool-User".

Awful, awful, name. Varlet would've been good. Knave. Malefactor. Lots of good solid words out there.

I think most of those names are either too esoteric or generic and don’t really feel like an improvement on Illrigger, which I agree has always sounded silly to me. But I think Hellknight just works for the concept and sounds better than anti-Paladin. Is it too narrow a concept? Perhaps, but I’m not too hung up on classes having to be supportive of a slew of subclasses. Creatively, it’s lands one in the same place as the Druid, IMO.

 

[MGibster]

I learned a long time ago not to be too hung up over class names in D&D. Illrigger is a terrible, terrible name though.

 

[Eyes of Nine]

illrigger sounds like a sick catamaran

 

[EzekielRaiden]

I find that names are often forgiven in hindsight when they would have been uncomfortable while new, so while I empathize with the "illrigger just sounds wrong to me" concern, I suspect "blackguard" (especially if pronounced crisply, as "black guard" rather than "blaggard") would get the exact same reception if it weren't storied in the TTRPG space and instead were freshly-introduced in the year of our Lord 2024.

 

[GobHag]

It's one thing for Pathfinder to jack stuff from D&D. That's basically what Pathfinder is. It's another thing for the market leader to jack something as notable as an entire class from another brand.

I strongly disagree about Warlocks getting their patron at level 1. Narratively, I much prefer that they start out unsure of what kind of bargain they have struck and then are drawn deeper into it. In terms of game design, I think it gives the player time to get the feel for their character before having to decide on the big reveal. And I like that there is consistency across all the classes now.

If I'm playing a warlock, I'd prefer if I'm already deep into it.

And I despise this consistency, Make every subclass level 1.

 

[cbwjm]

I love the name illrigger, I just think it sounds cool.

 

[Minigiant]

If I'm playing a warlock, I'd prefer if I'm already deep into it.

And I despise this consistency, Make every subclass level 1.

That requires banning multiclassing.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

That requires banning multiclassing.

Taking multiclassing into account players don’t necessarily get their subclass at level 3 either.