D&D (2024) Martial/Caster fix.

[ezo]

Why should WotC bother? Just ban or change the spell if you don't like it.

Great. Why should WotC bother making the game then with that reasoning?

You can make your own classes, spells, races, monsters, and so on and so on and so on.

They "fixed" other spells, and even made changes to simulacrum, but didn't bother to fix this known problem.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Great. Why should WotC bother making the game then with that reasoning?

You can make your own classes, spells, races, monsters, and so on and so on and so on.

They "fixed" other spells, and even made changes to simulacrum, but didn't bother to fix this known problem.

One "unfixed" spell for a potential problem that unlikely you occur in all but the most rare of table games is not the same as, "why make the game at all". That's pretty darn hyperbolic to my mind. The fastest and easiest way to fix this is to do it at home.

 

[nevin]

Or when WotC releases a new edition/update they can fix errors that have been pointed out for years?

No DM intervention needed then.

Sure if the next dev pays attention and fixes what he may or may not care about at the time. Crazy I know that they don't check here first.

 

[nevin]

Great. Why should WotC bother making the game then with that reasoning?

You can make your own classes, spells, races, monsters, and so on and so on and so on.

They "fixed" other spells, and even made changes to simulacrum, but didn't bother to fix this known problem.

this known problem that only occurs in games with level 20 and above characters so what 300 games a year world wide?

 

[ezo]

Sure if the next dev pays attention and fixes what he may or may not care about at the time. Crazy I know that they don't check here first.

this known problem that only occurs in games with level 20 and above characters so what 300 games a year world wide?

Glad to know you came here just to troll. See ya.

 

[Corinnguard]

Then the Djinn Lords attack as you have ruined thier lives. HEHE

I was hoping that they would thank me because they wouldn't be pestered anymore by us wish-seeking mortals.

 

[ECMO3]

Great. Why should WotC bother making the game then with that reasoning?

Money of course.

 

[Willie the Duck]

Great. Why should WotC bother making the game then with that reasoning?

You can make your own classes, spells, races, monsters, and so on and so on and so on.

They "fixed" other spells, and even made changes to simulacrum, but didn't bother to fix this known problem.

Sure if the next dev pays attention and fixes what he may or may not care about at the time. Crazy I know that they don't check here first.

IMO, there is validity to both basic positions.

It would be good if known issues were addressed in the next ruleset, and it sometimes seems puzzling when they aren't ('do they not see what we've been complaining about on D&D forums for years?').

At the same time, the reason things like infinite simulacrum loops aren't fixed is because they don't show up in most games, and the devs are focused on making playable berserkers/beastmasters/monks, creating reasons to use battleaxe vs. longsword, and so forth. And yes, a simple 'no' fixes the simulacrum problem, while the others take someone (DM or dev) rebuilding classes or weapon tables.

 

[Ashrym]

Great, the simulacrums are never casting this spell. They are casting wish, which "duplicates" a spell of 8th level or lower, but doesn't actually cast that spell.

Wish duplicates casting the spell simulacrum that simulacra are banned from casting per the rules. I would just tell the player "no, casting the spell and duplicating the spell is the same thing." Done.

It's okay to tell no to the players.

Did you not read my post?

If you use wish, you have to rest to get it back before you can do the loop, and then the simulacrums will have wish, too.

You can't rest to recover wish after spending it on the simulacrum and then have the simulacrum cast wish. The simulacrum is created without the wish spell that way because the slot's been spent.

That doesn't actually stop repeatedly using the simulacrum spell to get a simulacrum with wish prepared slots to use it for some downtime shenanigans with a lot of money to spend.

 

[ezo]

Wish duplicates casting the spell simulacrum that simulacra are banned from casting per the rules. I would just tell the player "no, casting the spell and duplicating the spell is the same thing." Done.

It's okay to tell no to the players.

I perfectly acceptable ruling, but alas... not a rule.

You can't rest to recover wish after spending it on the simulacrum and then have the simulacrum cast wish. The simulacrum is created without the wish spell that way because the slot's been spent.

You can certainly recover the wish spell... why wouldn't you?

The first SIM doesn't have wish if you used it to create the SIM, which of course prevents the loop... which is why you create the first SIM with the simulacrum spell, not wish. Since you didn't use wish yourself, your SIM has it... and so do you still. And thus the loop begins...

That doesn't actually stop repeatedly using the simulacrum spell to get a simulacrum with wish prepared slots to use it for some downtime shenanigans with a lot of money to spend.

Yeah, once you have both spells you can literally "win" the game barring DM fiat.

Anyway... it was fun (not!) bringing this stuff up... again. Cheers.