D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

Them BG3 cones out made by European company featuring material that would be at home in 3.0s book of vile darkness. Gets a billion on sales in about a month or so more money than 5E did in 10 years.

WotC can't capitalize on it because they're treating the customer base as infants who can't handle mature content. BG3 existence proves the neo puritans wrong.
Not only is the idea that BG3 sold more than 5e laughably false, but the huge difference here is that tabletop gaming has become significantly more diverse over the years while video gaming has massively regressed due to alt-right movements. (Let's not forget that everything going on in right-wing America now is stuff that was engineered and tested in the video game community before expanding to mainstream politics.)

What BG3 and video gamers think is "mature content" is laughably puerile. This is a game with a storyline about how a white dude is so awesome at magic the goddess of magic had the hots for him (and how women are total bleeps for rejecting him). It's a game where characters of non-white-coded species have no identity outside of their species "hat" (which is usually "stupid evil" or "victims"). It takes what should be a horrifying premise and turns it into a power fantasy with literally no consequences whatsoever. It's stuff that would end up on /r/rpghorrorstories if anyone tried to play it straight in a real game.

When people complain about things being "sanitized", it's usually just that the writers have matured themselves and have moved away from stories and tropes that dehumanize anyone who isn't a straight white male. BG3 (and other games that Gamers adore or vilify) simply demonstrates that there are still holdouts of this sort of mentality in certain mediums.
 

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Not only is the idea that BG3 sold more than 5e laughably false, but the huge difference here is that tabletop gaming has become significantly more diverse over the years while video gaming has massively regressed due to alt-right movements. (Let's not forget that everything going on in right-wing America now is stuff that was engineered and tested in the video game community before expanding to mainstream politics.)

What BG3 and video gamers think is "mature content" is laughably puerile. This is a game with a storyline about how a white dude is so awesome at magic the goddess of magic had the hots for him (and how women are total bleeps for rejecting him). It's a game where characters of non-white-coded species have no identity outside of their species "hat" (which is usually "stupid evil" or "victims"). It takes what should be a horrifying premise and turns it into a power fantasy with literally no consequences whatsoever. It's stuff that would end up on /r/rpghorrorstories if anyone tried to play it straight in a real game.

When people complain about things being "sanitized", it's usually just that the writers have matured themselves and have moved away from stories and tropes that dehumanize anyone who isn't a straight white male. BG3 (and other games that Gamers adore or vilify) simply demonstrates that there are still holdouts of this sort of mentality in certain mediums.

I don't think Gale being in love with a goddess is a big deal.

Main point is the product might not be for you no big deal.

New Minecraft movie. Big hit. Not for me 0 appeal.

BG3 broke a billion in sales vrryy early btw. Peak 5E was 160 million a year iirc. It took several years to ramp up to that.

BG3 has filters and doesn't preach. Don't like nudity turn it off. Don't like XYZ don't do it a lot is opt In.

WotC made more money off it in 1 year than most 5E years.

I said mature because of things like full frontal nudity and a couple of optional romance options.
 


I don't think Gale being in love with a goddess is a big deal.
You might not think it's such a big deal for a major female figure from the franchise's canon to be reduced to a prop to make a white guy look awesome and smart, and then derail her character into being both pointlessly callous and also stupid because they didn't want said white guy to have a storyline about having any real character flaws of his own.

This is the same game that has a black guy who needed to make a deal with a fiend to get his magical powers, and his plotline is about how he never conceived that this would have any sort of repercussions for him.
 

You might not think it's such a big deal for a major female figure from the franchise's canon to be reduced to a prop to make a white guy look awesome and smart, and then derail her character into being both pointlessly callous and also stupid because they didn't want said white guy to have a storyline about having any real character flaws of his own.

This is the same game that has a black guy who needed to make a deal with a fiend to get his magical powers, and his plotline is about how he never conceived that this would have any sort of repercussions for him.

You also miss out the black guys a folk hero and has the best solo story playthrough out of the origin characters except dark urge.

The white guy is funny he's also a blow hard and the goddess dumped him basically. He's a sage.

Folk hero fires a lot more than sage. Wyll also gets a kick ass unique weapon.
 

This is a game with a storyline about how a white dude is so awesome at magic the goddess of magic had the hots for him (and how women are total bleeps for rejecting him
A creepy sex-pest who, if they survive to the end, shows that they have learned nothing and is determined to repeat the same mistakes all over again.

The trouble with satire is it invariably goes over the head of its intended target (call it the Starship Troopers effect), but if you know the game was written by liberal Europeans, the subtext is there to see.
 

Politics
A creepy sex-pest who, if they survive to the end, shows that they have learned nothing and is determined to repeat the same mistakes all over again.

The trouble with satire is it invariably goes over the head of its intended target (call it the Starship Troopers effect), but if you know the game was written by liberal Europeans, the subtext is there to see.

Muricans funny. Liberial ones can be surprisingly puritanical at times.

Their pop cultures about 20-30 years behind ours and ham fisted. We lean towards Euroe but undercutting sarcasm a'la UK.

I've seen worse here looking out my apartment window in 2004 than BG3 romance scene 2024. Go smoke pot in the police station 2009 arrests 0. That was one of my players lol.
 

Anti-inclusive content
I don't consider myself a conservative gamer but I do consider myself a grognard of sorts with a D&D history going back 40 years. I consider myself inclusive and cosmopolitan in real life and in my gaming. However, I do find that in D&D (and role-playing in general) as well as modern society that doesn't sit well with me on some level.

The experience and advice of long time role-players is often ignored by the newer generation. Here on these very forums twenty years ago I tried to offer advice to new players who came here asking for it, and I was repeatedly told that (and I quote) "Your experience is not relevant". At the time 3rd edition had brought in a lot of new blood to the hobby which was great but my intuition was that it brought in people from the growing MMO community where optimisation and being the best of the best was how you played. They weren't interested in how the game was played or advice from that those who played before. They played the way they wanted and D&D has changed because of it. How people play now has changed and it does feel like us older player have been somewhat left behind and forgotten. I'm pleased that the hobby continues to draw in more and more new players paving the way to the future but it's obvious why us older role-players can get grumpy over what can be perceived as unnecessary changes in direction.

As shown in a recent thread on here, art is subjective too. Like all of us, I know what I like and what I don't. I used to like the old B&W artwork because it felt like it captured the essence of D&D perfectly. Aesthetics have changed now and D&D doesn't resemble a faux medieval world any more. It's more like World of Warcraft or League of Legends. I know players who really don't like the art direction now and how it doesn't fit their view of D&D (I hated the Dungeonpunk of 3rd edition for example). For myself, I'll take the artwork as a guideline and my setting will look like how I want it to - which for reference has changed, and in recent years has been influenced by Arcane and the LoL art style. Even I've changed.

Then you get the (and I hate this term) the "Woke" factor. Species instead of race. Male mariliths, hag's, dryads, banshees...etc. Vistani are apparently racist despite being an archetype within a game setting (I never saw the old WoD Gypsies book as racist either for the same reason). Concepts that don't always sit right with those of us from an older generation. Society is changing for the better but does it need to impact D&D? In some places yes, and in others no. Despite what is in the Monster Manual, my games will continue to showcase things as we always have done but then my games are not public so it has no effect on others. But again, I can see where the more conservative players might feel these changes being forced unnecessarily out there.

I see both sides and rather than heated discussions where neither side seems willing to understand the other's view point, I think that we need to understand that the blessing and curse of role-playing games is that we all play them different and we desire different things from it.

Hopefully this came across in a positive way.
 

As far as Thaco the clown, I thought it was just an Easter egg for grognards, you have to be inventive to consider it an insult. Is the inclusion here and there of the cartoon characters also some sort of insult?
i mean, 'the longest serving witchlight hand, a grumpy over-the-hill clown that works as a gatekeeper and who hates kids' named after one of the most recognizable mechanics of earlier DnD editions, it doesn't take that much inventiveness to fit the pieces together and see the insult.
 

I've played more than a few gnomes over the years, and I loved the 4E gnome monster videos.

As to Thaco the clown, I liked him as well, though I can see how some folks might interpret him as mean spirited mockery. Personally it seemed more like a loving tongue in cheek homage, given that most modern gamers wouldn't even know what Thaco is.
I played during the Thac0 years and I still don't know what it is. 😳
 

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