hawkeyefan
Legend
And that right there you're taking away the players' ability to drive.
Part of both sandbox and player-driven play is to let the players decide what minor stuff they're going to spend loads of time on and what they're going to largely skip over.
Here, if you describe the scene at the gate with the two guards casually asking questions of the farmers bringing their goods in to market, it's up to the players to decide whether they're going to go deep in the weeds about how they deal with these guards or whether they're just going to head in through the gate...or turn around and go somewhere else, whatever.
In other words, give 'em the scene and let the players decide what in it is meaningful to them; and if it means the session is largely spent dealing with two gate guards rather than all the various deep intrigues in town then so be it. The town intrigues can wait until next session.
It largely depends. Typically, I’m going to know what it is the players want. And it’s not likely to be dickering with guards… likely they’re interested in whatever’s beyond the guards.
So I’m not going to draw that out and treat it as if it’s as meaningful as other scenes or situations. I’m going to give them the info they need to decide how to handle the obstacle the guards present, and then see what they do about it.
I don’t want to run or play in a game where “hey this is kinda dull and beside the point, but so be it”. No thank you.
All you've found out there is that the guard can't be bribed by you right at this moment.
You've learned nothing about the guard in general, including whether someone else in your party can succeed where you have failed.
I think you missed the point. I was explaining how the result of the dice roll can be the thing that determines if the guard can be bribed or not. So if I rolled well enough, the guard is open to being bribed. If I rolled poorly, he is not open to a bribe.
The die roll can be what determines this rather than the GM doing so before play.
Which would seem to be the point of having an un-bribe-able guard.
Right, but then you’re making a decision as a GM that shuts down an entire method of dealing with the guard. Which is fine… but that impacts what’s available to the players and that’s something that should be considered when the decision is made.
Those are different things than outright bribing the guard. If you manage to fail on both those attempts as well then the pattern suggests there's something about you this guard really doesn't like and you might be better off just trying a different gate.![]()
Again, you’re missing the point. If a critical success or compelling freeform RP both result in a failure, then what we’re talking about is the GM not allowing any chance for success.
Sometimes absolutes do occur, even in real life. Here in this example, for all you-as-PC know the guard might be quite open to bribes most of the time, but not right now 'cause his hard-ass martinet of a sergeant-at-arms is watching his every move from the guardhouse.
But that’s not really the reason. The reason is because the GM decided ahead of time that nothing would work. Which may be fine based on preference and expectations. But we’ve largely been talking about GM decisions and how they impact player agency or player-directed play.
Deciding this kind of stuff ahead of time seems to be more about GM directed play than anything else. This is what the GM has decoded, so this is what will be.
have to give D&D 2024 huge props for calling out that you can do 3rd person/glossed over conversations as a scene tool & as an accessibility framework right in the core examples of play in the PHB. That's advancing the art in the biggest game in the western play space.
I agree it’s nice to hear that. I switch freely between first and third person when I play… pretty much have always done so. And it’s especially useful to narrate certain scenes quickly.