Where is the National Guard?

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Sacrosanct

Legend
OMG! This country was founded by terrorists!

They're not called terrorists when they're on our side.

terroristirony.jpg
 

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Umbran

Mod Squad
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Because you think guns are bad, you see threats and terror and scary people. Thing is, though, that just because it's scary to you doesn't make it illegal.

I think threatening to shoot law enforcement officers in the lawful act of performing their duties probably breaks some laws.
 


Now, if you pull your gun out in the bank and brandish it, bets are off.
Not in an open carry state, like Texas for example. The guy may just be cleaning his gun or adjusting it. That is, unless he is black. All bets are off if it's a black guy. All the other open carry supporters depositing their government checks will shoot him down in self defense.
 

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel
If we're going to say it's not wholly black people's fault for being poor and being desperate to resort to crime, then we also have to accept it's not wholly the cop's fault for being hard on the demographic that makes their job hard (which in turn makes their job harder).
There certainly are terrible black people out there, but the idea that responsability is evenly distributed between the oppressed and the oppressor is hard to swallow. The number of black people who commit crime is rather small. Higher than white people, yes, but still small. Cops aren't force by black people to stop them when they drive cars or perform "stop and frisk" on them. Black people do not tend to open carry, cause that leads to them getting shot. It's everyday racism and how these men from Y'all Qaeda are treated is just one example of the double standards in affect.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
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Saying you will defend yourself from officers using illegal deadly force isn't, though.

To make sure we are all on the same page, what they have said (according to CNN.com) is:

"We have no intentions of using force upon anyone, (but) if force is used against us, we would defend ourselves."

The word "deadly" do not appear. Nor, admittedly, is there a clear statement that they intended specifically to shoot law enforcement officials.

However, their occupation of a federal installation is not legal. If they are not going to go willingly and quietly, then some amount of force (not deadly force, but force, nonetheless) may be required* to remove them - law enforcement may need to go in, restrain them, and carry them out. Using force to resist arrest is not legal. Giving credible threats to law enforcement officers in action of duty is, I expect, illegal.

*It is winter - the smart play is probably to cut power and access to the facility, and just wait them out. Any supplies they brought will eventually run out, and they don't dare start hunting with firearms, as if they shoot a law enforcement officer who didn't shoot first, they are quite legally toast.
 

Sacrosanct

Legend
There certainly are terrible black people out there, but the idea that responsability is evenly distributed between the oppressed and the oppressor is hard to swallow. The number of black people who commit crime is rather small. Higher than white people, yes, but still small. Cops aren't force by black people to stop them when they drive cars or perform "stop and frisk" on them. Black people do not tend to open carry, cause that leads to them getting shot. It's everyday racism and how these men from Y'all Qaeda are treated is just one example of the double standards in affect.


This video certainly supports evidence of a double standard.
 

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel
As true as this might be, it's relevant to the broader issue of race relations and racism in the US... but not really to the resolution of the situation in Oregon. That authorities and the media might behave badly if these were African-Americans or Muslims shouldn't be justification for behaving badly with the current situation.
I'm not sure how calling these guys something else than "peaceful protestors" would be unfair mediatic treatment.

And the government can't just let this go. It creates a worrisome precedent. Well, the first Bundy incident did and it gave them incentive to do it again.
 

Kramodlog

Naked and living in a barrel
And at Ipperwash, Dudley George was killed.
At least someone was procecuted.

That clearly wasn't what I said, was it? I said that different methods need to be used, other than armed confrontation. A heavy hand simply puts the match to the powder.
They can try to starve them out, but a confrontation seems inevitable unless the feds fold.
 


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