D&D 3E/3.5 3.5 Only Smackdown

[FrankTrollman]

So, is there any armor/weapon using creature out there with better Dex/natural armor/size AC modifiers than the Solar?

Well, there's some bits of craziness in non-core books (especially the ELH) - but not in the 3.5 Core Books, no.

-Frank

 

[Shadeus]

Another AC exercise
+ 7 Large Shield +5
+ 5 Defending Large Shield +5
+ 5 Defending Dwarven Waraxe + 5

I think you have one two many items there in your hands at once. You can have a shield of defending? Here's my stab at a high AC man:


10th-level fighter/10th-level duelist

Base: 10

+11 Natural Armor (polymorph into a green hag)
+13 Dex (18 base + 5 [levels] + 5 [inherit] + 6 [gloves] + 2 [hag])
+7 shield - heavy shield +5
+8 armor - bracers of armor +8
+5 unnamed - +5 rapier of defending
+10 dodge - duelist fight defensively bonus
+3 dodge - fight defensively
+1 insight - ioun stone
+5 deflection - +5 ring of protection
+5 natural armor - potion of barkskin
+1 Dodge - dodge feat
+5 Dodge - combat expertise
+1 haste - haste spell
---
AC 85

The only spells in use are potions that any fighter can use. Otherwise, like Frank already mentioned, you can increase you natural armor by polymorphing any object into a dragon or solar.

 

[Shadeus]

Double post

 

[Saeviomagy]

I think you have one two many items there in your hands at once. You can have a shield of defending? Here's my stab at a high AC man:

I think perhaps the second entry should have read "+5 defending shield spikes"

Then they not only stack, but you can have the defending enchantment on them.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Race: Dwarf
Druid 8 (for large wildshape)
Monk 1
Dwarven Defender 1
Duellist 10
AC bonus from monk for wis 34 (18, 5 level increases, +5 book, +6 enhancement) = +12
Wear wild dragonskin full plate + 5 = +13
Wear an amulet of natural armour = +5
Wildshape to a dire bat (+5 natural armour, 32 dex (naturally 22, +4 from book, +6 from enhancement), -1 size) = +15
Alter self into a troglodyte (remember - your NORMAL form is humanoid) +6 natural armour replaces +5, size becomes medium again: +2
Ring of protection +5: +5
Opposable, +5, defending sickles = +10
Wild, +5 large shield = +7
Expertise = +5
5+ranks in tumble, fight defensively = +3
Canny defense for 28 int (18, +4 from book, +6 enhancement) = 9
Elaborate parry = +10
Defensive stance = +4
Animal growth from a spell-trigger item = +1 (-1 size, +2 natural)
Ioun stone = +1
Dodge feat = +1
Boots of haste = +1
So far... 103

A point - I've totally and utterly blown the gear cash limit, I think. Can anyone check? I've only got the SRD to work with

2x stat enhancers: 72000
2x stat Books: 247500
2 x +5 defending sickles: 100612
Wild, +5 shield: 64157
Ring of protection +5: 50000
Wild dragonhide full plate +5: 67300
Scroll of animal growth: 1125
Amulet of natural armour +5: 50000
Potion of alter self : 300
Boots of haste: 12000
total: 664994

 

[Hypersmurf]

I think perhaps the second entry should have read "+5 defending shield spikes"

Then they not only stack, but you can have the defending enchantment on them.

What he wants is a +5 (shield enhancement) / +5 Defending (weapon enhancement/special ability) Large Spiked Shield... or, indeed, a +5 (shield enhancement) / +5 Defending (weapon enhancement/special ability) Large Shield - the spikes are completely unnecessary.

"An enhancement bonus on a shield does not improve the effectiveness of a shield bash made with it, but the shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right."

and

"An enhancement bonus on a spiked shield does not improve the effectiveness of a shield bash made with it, but a spiked shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right."

Whether or not you have spikes, you can craft weapon enhancements and special abilities into the shield. Not the spikes as a separate item, but the shield or the spiked shield.

And that's exactly what Jabberwocky has done - he's got a +5 (shield enhancement) / +5 Defending (weapon enhancement/special ability) Large Shield (no spikes). For ease of reading, he's listed it on two lines:

+5 Large Shield (the shield enhancement)
+5 Defending Large Shield (the weapon enhancement and special ability)

He hasn't actually listed two shields; he's listed the two disparate qualities of the same shield on two lines.

-Hyp.

 

[jabberwocky]

A point - I've totally and utterly blown the gear cash limit, I think. Can anyone check? I've only got the SRD to work with

2x stat enhancers: 72000
youve got three stat enhancers so : 108000

2x stat Books: 247500
3 books as well +4/+4/+5:357,500

2 x +5 defending sickles: 100612
the cost are for +6 weapons so 144,612

total: 664994
the extra 190,000 pushes you to 854,994 gp.
you can drop 128,000 by making +1 sickles and having greater magic weapon cast on them - and you can do the same for your armor/shield with magic vestment which will shave off another 96,000, dropping you back into reasonable price range.
So, the wild armor doesnt reappear when you change shape again? Is that a specific alter self effect, or could you wild shape, be polymorphed into a Solar, and retain the merged armor?
And has it been clarified if you are considered to be wearing (for armor check penalties/monk AC/etc) merged wild armor or not?

Well done on getting over 100 AC!

 

[Silverglass]

I think you have one two many items there in your hands at once. You can have a shield of defending? Here's my stab at a high AC man:


10th-level fighter/10th-level duelist

Base: 10

+11 Natural Armor (alter self into a green hag)
+13 Dex (18 base + 5 [levels] + 5 [inherit] + 6 [gloves] + 2 [hag])
+7 shield - heavy shield +5
+13 armor - +5 full plate mail

<snip> ---
AC 90

The only spells in use are potions that any fighter can use. Otherwise, like Frank already mentioned, you can increase you natural armor by polymorphing any object into a dragon or solar.

The problem with this is that +5 Full Plate limits your Dex Bonus to AC to +1 (or +3 if Mithril). You'd be better off using Bracers of Armour (although you'd need to exclude the shield to apply Canny Defense but that might take you higher).

 

[Shadeus]

The problem with this is that +5 Full Plate limits your Dex Bonus to AC to +1 (or +3 if Mithril). You'd be better off using Bracers of Armour (although you'd need to exclude the shield to apply Canny Defense but that might take you higher).

Duh, good call. I will go find a rock to hide under now. I also had a +2 Dex mod from an alter self spell which would only happen with a polymorph. I modified mine, but Saeviomagy's is still much better.

 

[Saeviomagy]

So, the wild armor doesnt reappear when you change shape again?
Is that a specific alter self effect, or could you wild shape, be polymorphed into a Solar, and retain the merged armor?

From the srd on the wild enchantment:
The wearer of a suit of armor or a shield with this ability preserves his armor bonus (and any enhancement bonus) while in a wild shape. Armor and shields with this ability usually appear to be made covered in leaf patterns. While the wearer is in a wild shape, the armor cannot be seen.

From the srd on alter self (the root of wildshape):
When the change occurs, your equipment, if any, either remains worn or held by the new form (if it is capable of wearing or holding the item), or melds into the new form and becomes nonfunctional. When you revert to your true form, any objects previously melded into the new form reappear in the same location on your body they previously occupied and are once again functional.

So - We wild shape, our armour becomes non-functional (meaning all of it's attributes cease to apply). EXCEPT the wild enchantment specifically says that armour and enhancement bonuses from the item still apply while in a wild shape.

Then we alter self into another form. We haven't returned to our true form, so our gear doesn't reappear. I suppose technically it could be said that we're no longer in "a wild shape" (which is an undefined term), although we are still under the effect of "wild shape".

The druid COULD use a single charge staff of shapechange (only 3375 gold for 25th caster level) and then assume the form of a great wyrm gold dragon, which would replace 10 points of the AC of the build with the 42 AC of the great wyrm, bumping the build's AC to 134. And incidentally, I don't need to take more than 5 levels of druid now (because I don't need dire bat form for AC any more...) - can anyone get me more AC from 3 levels somewhere? The only problems with this is that you need to have great-wyrm sized versions of most of the gear, and that you need to succeed at using the scroll. Alternately solar form could be used instead - lowering the AC of the build to a mere 119, and the price of the single shot staff to only 2295.

And has it been clarified if you are considered to be wearing (for armor check penalties/monk AC/etc) merged wild armor or not?

It probably SHOULD be, but currently, it just says that the armour ceases to function, but you retain the enhancement and armour bonuses.

Well done on getting over 100 AC!