D&D 3E/3.5 4E reminded me how much I like 3E

[underfoot007]

In the six years I've been D&D 3.5, I have never seen any of my players take more than 2 regular classes and one prestige class. Yet, they are regularly able to defeat level appropriate challenges.

Your claim, methinks, is specious.

humm, you play in a gaming group of what? 5-6 players. I attend many local conventions including genCon, and see hundreds or thousands of gamers. Methinks you need to expand your sample selection.

The people in my gaming group play the same way your group does (mostly single classes). Not everyone does this, sorry if you think I implyed EVERYONE does this. I personal prefer single class chatacters, and I really like the multiclass options in 4E.

 

[Starbuck_II]

In the six years I've been D&D 3.5, I have never seen any of my players take more than 2 regular classes and one prestige class. Yet, they are regularly able to defeat level appropriate challenges.

Your claim, methinks, is specious.

Well, it may have more to do with DM fuidge than actual 3.5 rules.

I mean, level apropriate encounters: give us some examples. What classes do they play.

If they play Cleric, Wizard, or Druid than obviously no more than 2 classes: Straight of either is very powerful.

Straight Rogue not as much (I mean level 20 gives nothing)

 

[Storm Raven]

Oh really, Wulf? I didn't major in NPC Generation 101, and pity the people whose livelihoods relied on generating 3E NPC stats with classes and stuff, such as at Paizo.

I didn't major in NPC Generation 101 either, and I never had any trouble coming up with NPCs using the 3e rules. They aren't hard to do, usually quite easy most of the time.

 

[Spatula]

Defending 3E against hyperbolic criticism is not the same as attacking 4E.

Lies! Everyone must pick a side and relentlessly attack anyone who shows the slightest glimmer of not agreeing with you!

Throw me down in the column of not needing software to make NPCs. Dealing with high-level casters is a major PITA that I dread, but the problem there is 3e's over-the-top buff structure, and I don't know any NPC generator program what would help with that. Generating stats, skills, feats, adding templates, etc. is all pretty basic stuff. You don't need to re-invent the wheel with every NPC.

Oh good grief. Playing D&D or any game isn't about "manning up", or having "what it takes" to DM.

DMing requires different skills than simply playing. It also requires more time spent out of game. It's extra work, extra responsibility, and not everyone finds it to be enjoyable. Which is all Wulf was saying.

 

[Ahnehnois]

I picked up a bunch of 3.5 stuff just before and again just after the 4e announcement last year. Alot of it was really good. UA is really good. My 3.5 is well houseruled to fix what I perceive to be its problems, but I never was disenchanted with it. 3e/3.5 is a good game. Modular, detailed, and with an easy to understand backbone.

 

[Gailbraithe]

and last but not least

• d) Majoring in NPC generation 101 and doing all the work yourself

I have my Masters in NPC Generation. I got it from Miskatonic University.

I minored in Making Players Cry.

 

[Hussar]

I picked up a bunch of 3.5 stuff just before and again just after the 4e announcement last year. Alot of it was really good. UA is really good. My 3.5 is well houseruled to fix what I perceive to be its problems, but I never was disenchanted with it. 3e/3.5 is a good game. Modular, detailed, and with an easy to understand backbone.

Now this is true. I think most people will agree with you here.

IMO, 3e has a few weak spots - particularly at higher levels - that I think 4e fixes. That does not mean I don't like 3e.

I've never understood why recognizing system flaws equates with hating an edition.

 

[Ahnehnois]

I picked up a bunch of 3.5 stuff just before and again just after the 4e announcement last year. Alot of it was really good. UA is really good. My 3.5 is well houseruled to fix what I perceive to be its problems, but I never was disenchanted with it. 3e/3.5 is a good game. Modular, detailed, and with an easy to understand backbone.

 

[Wormwood]

I have my Masters in NPC Generation.

I dropped the class when I found out nobody was checking my math.

 

[Hussar]

On NPC generation.

Look, if it was so easy, why do the professionals screw it up just about every time? People who do it for a living complain about how hard it is to stat up NPC's. Saying that NPC statting is overly complex is hardly a damning criticism and has been noted by an awful lot of people.