D&D General A glimpse at WoTC's current view of Rule 0

[FrozenNorth]

For me? I think some DMs need to get over themselves and learn that ban-this, ban-that is actually a pretty destructive way to run games.

I certainly agree we need more DMs. I don't see how that has any intersection whatsoever with the topic at hand.

I'm not your slave. I am not running a game that is a lousy experience for me. I'm working up a campaign and proposing it to people and those people opt in or opt out.

I don’t see how to interpret this other than « if I as a DM don’t get final say in everything, I’m a slave to my players ».

Which seems to reinforce @EzekielRaiden ‘s point about DM unreasonableness (#notallDMs).

 

[Micah Sweet]

100% serious. And as soon as I mention something I've created, it's no longer my personal imagination, it's part of the shared fiction.

If I'm immersed in my character being drunk and angry in a bar, I don't want to ask the DM who the bar patrons are around me. I just want to narrate my character punching the nearest dude.

I will never understand this being immersive.

 

[TwoSix]

I kinda feel otherwise, but this probably has more to do how different people internalise information. But to me having an actual person with whom I can interact and ask questions about the things I feel are relevant is more useful than a massive tome of information that I need to read and memorise. Besides, some GMs write such tomes. I don't, I try to keep my written world information relatively brief, just covering most important facts and general vibes, and more detailed information can be filled in as needed.

For me, asking is the worst method. Reading pre-generated material is solid. Not needing lore information at all is best.

 

[FrozenNorth]

It's funny - I remember a time when it was the opposite problem. Players would show up with two-plus pages of backstory that the DM was somehow supposed to incorporate into their campaign. Maybe it's still like that for some tables.

I like your point, but is it possible to somehow blame the younger generation for this change?

 

[AnotherGuy]

You're really got to stop assuming everyone has the ultra-sandbox approach you do, man. In most cases just following the flow unlimitedly is not what GMs are interested in doing, and to assume they will in this situation is just projecting what, as far as I can tell, is pretty fringe approach on the rest of the hobby.

I'm not sure that is a fair statement, the ones that play many of the indie games such as @pemerton, play from my perspective (and he can correct me if I'm wrong on this) ultra-sandboxes, the players drive the story and the direction of the story even more so than games that Lanefan and myself are running.

You'd discounting quite a number of posters if you think that is fringe.

 

[Oofta]

100% serious. And as soon as I mention something I've created, it's no longer my personal imagination, it's part of the shared fiction.

If I'm immersed in my character being drunk and angry in a bar, I don't want to ask the DM who the bar patrons are around me. I just want to narrate my character punching the nearest dude.

Nothing stops your character from punching the nearest dude if the bar has other patrons. In games I enjoy I just won't be able to dictate who the dude is. Maybe it's no one special and I lay them out with one punch, maybe it's the Duke's favorite son and I just made a powerful enemy. Maybe it's a high level monk the DM was intending to introduce to the group and he deflects my inept punch back into my face. That to me is what makes the game immersive. I only know what my player knows and the world responds to my words and actions.

 

[Thomas Shey]

It's funny - I remember a time when it was the opposite problem. Players would show up with two-plus pages of backstory that the DM was somehow supposed to incorporate into their campaign. Maybe it's still like that for some tables.

I do have to point out that, while not usually D&D or other generic fantasy games, that's a virtue in some times of games and campaigns. "Too much backstory" is not something you'll usually hear people complain about in a superhero game for example.

 

[FrozenNorth]

That’s what I would tend to do, but the issue seems to be “who makes the spot ruling?”. There seems to be several people who cannot trust anyone other than themselves to make the spot ruling.

I think even the most player-side posters are fine with DMs making a spot ruling in order to avoid slowing down the game, so long as the issue gets a fair hearing afterwards. To emphasize, I don’t even think this is controversial: it’s the same approach when a rule is forgotten.

 

[TwoSix]

I will never understand this being immersive.

Note: I'm just presenting my perspective, this is not a "right or wrong" thing.

For me, if I'm getting immersed, that means my mind's eye is the focus, not my (me as an actual human being) physical senses.

And that means I have a clear picture in my mind's eye of what's happening now, in the moment around me (as a character). Having to ask what's happening now means my mind's eye isn't actually immersed in the situation. When I'm immersed, I can see what's happening now, and am focused on what's happening next.

 

[FrozenNorth]

By running a Star Wars game, the DM is already ceding a large chunk of control of the setting at the beginning. Star Wars is a setting. The players should expect to play Star Wars.

I just don’t think that « having control of the setting » is or should be an important part of the draw when I DM.