A TSR Announces a Star Frontiers Reboot

One of the new TSRs (yes there are now two TSRs!) has announced a reboot of Star Frontiers, the sci-fi game made by the original TSR back in the 1980s. Star Frontiers was a percentile dice roleplaying game set in a galaxy with four races (Human, Dralasite, Vrusk, and Yazirian) which were re-used by WotC in d20 Future in 2004.

Happy to announce that in addition to our flagship new world and game system by James M. Ward & Dinehart, GiantLands, and Justin LaNasa's children's RPG Tales & Tots, our next internal project "Star Frontiers", a reboot of the original, is currently in preproduction and has Larry Elmore attached. Stay tuned for more details!

It appears that one of the new TSRs registered the trademark in April. More if I hear it!

You can currently buy the game from WotC on DriveThruRpg, so I'm not sure how that works. When asked about this on Facebook, one of the TSRs answered:

Of course, Evil Hat Productions registered the Star Frontiers trademark, too, back in July 2017.

Is Evil Hat Republishing TSR's Star Frontiers?

Last year, Sasquatch Game Studio announced that it had acquired the trademark for TSR's old Alternity science-fiction game. At the time, it was mentioned that they did not have the Star*Drive, Dark*Matter, Gamma World, StarCraft Adventures, or Star Frontiers, properties owned by WotC. This may...

www.enworld.org

 

[Knightfall]

To rely on lawyers to save your butts while blatantly stealing copyrighted material (that image) is so ridiculous. They are just asking to be sued and I guarantee Hasbro and/or WotC's lawyers are going to overrun TSR's lawyers if they don't comply.

I was looking forward to getting a copy of Giant Lands, but, if they are going to be arrogant about breaking copyright rules, yeah, I don't think so. A trademark is not a copyright (no, I'm not a lawyer)!

If they somehow manage to not to get destroyed in court (and go under) and apologize for stealing a copyrighted image, I might forgive them for their hubris.

 

[darjr]

@Knightfall I don't like that they used that image in their promo.... but.... I think it was just a dumb mistake. I don't think they intend to steal IP for the actual game. I think, I hope.

Still without it it seems rather pointless to me. A tulip labeled a rose is not a rose.

I think if they had a wotc license they'd have said so? Also I don't think they would have needed to capture the trademark. Or wotc wouldn't have appreciated that anyway. But what do I know?

 

[Knightfall]

@Knightfall I don't like that they used that image in their promo.... but.... I think it was just a dumb mistake. I don't think they intend to steal IP for the actual game. I think, I hope.

Maybe. And that's a big maybe. If James Ward is deeply involved, let's not forget a little company called Fast Forward Entertainment and how that ended. And, yes, I liked and bought many of those d20 books and still own the best ones.

But, the use of WotC's copyrights cost FFE and you would think that Mr. Ward (if not any of the others involved with this new TSR) would know better. Maybe, maybe those handling the marketing logistics didn't think before using the image, but fool me once...

I'm not going to invest in a company that could go out of business by ignoring copyright laws.

Still without it it seems rather pointless to me. A tulip labeled a rose is not a rose.

I think if they had a wotc license they'd have said so? Also I don't think they would have needed to capture the trademark. Or wotc wouldn't have appreciated that anyway. But what do I know?

Personally, I wasn't a huge fan of Star Frontiers back in the day, so if they had to create a different setting with different species, so be it. That's what has happened with Alternity, 2nd Edition, and I really loved the first version and have bought several of the books for the 2nd Edition. Of course, that was more a rule system than a setting.

 

[Parmandur]

@Knightfall I don't like that they used that image in their promo.... but.... I think it was just a dumb mistake. I don't think they intend to steal IP for the actual game. I think, I hope.

Still without it it seems rather pointless to me. A tulip labeled a rose is not a rose.

I think if they had a wotc license they'd have said so? Also I don't think they would have needed to capture the trademark. Or wotc wouldn't have appreciated that anyway. But what do I know?

Yeah, I'm dubious that this will work out.

 

[Umbran]

I'm not going to invest in a company that could go out of business by ignoring copyright laws.

Is someone asking you to? You've been offered stock options, or something?

 

[ECMO3]

I don't know if it is in wizard's best interest to get involved in a copyright battle for several reasons:

1. The fights TSR had with the internet in the 90s and the fights wizard had during 3E did not actually help the company. They did protect the IP but they also alienated gamers and this led to the TSR collapse and Pathfinder taking market share from D&D respectfully.

2. I don't think there is enough money in it to justify the PR hit. This could jeopardize 5E, which is selling like gangbusters right now. The last thing they want is a court battle where big bad Hasbro goes after the little guy. This is especially true if E. Gygax is one of the guys running it.

Given those things, I don't think the juice is worth the squeeze. To be honest a star frontiers reboot might actually cause an increase in sales from the old stuff on drive through RPG.

If anything I would expect WOTC to quietly send a C&D to cover their bases for potential future litigation and then ignore it if TSR lawyers up.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

They actually have to fight it. Failure to defend your copyrights and trademarks has been cited in court rulings as evidence of them being up for grabs.

TSR 3.0 is starting a fight they cannot win over a property that wasn't going to be a big money-earner even before their legal costs were factored into it.

 

[MGibster]

Is someone asking you to? You've been offered stock options, or something?

In this particular case, I don't imagine Knightfall meant investing money in the company with the intent of reaping a profit. Rather they meant investing as in devoting time or effort into their products in the hopes of achieving some worthwhile results. i.e. I've invested heavily in D&D books and miniatures, and in return they've provided me with many, many hours of entertainment.

 

[billd91]

They actually have to fight it. Failure to defend your copyrights and trademarks has been cited in court rulings as evidence of them being up for grabs.

Trademark you have to defend or risk losing it, copyright you don't because you can't lose it. Opponents might argue that a history of not defending a copyright indicates the holder puts little value in it and could, I suppose, undermine damages sought. But there's no way to lose a copyright by not defending it.

 

[Parmandur]

Trademark you have to defend or risk losing it, copyright you don't because you can't lose it. Opponents might argue that a history of not defending a copyright indicates the holder puts little value in it and could, I suppose, undermine damages sought. But there's no way to lose a copyright by not defending it.

WotC has the copyright, "TSR" has filed for the Trademark...but WotC is still selling Star Frontier products, sooooo...not sure this is anything that will come rto fruition.