AI is stealing writers’ words and jobs…

[Maxperson]

Is it fair use to consume something you never paid for?

Probably not, but possibly yes. Or maybe they rule that the extent it is being used is against, but some middle ground is okay. Until the ruling happens, we do not know.

 

[Scribe]

Probably not, but possibly yes. Or maybe they rule that the extent it is being used is against, but some middle ground is okay. Until the ruling happens, we do not know.

So one can consume what they dont own (how did they acquire these things...hmm) and then profit off of it?

Will the wonders of the modern lobbyist profession never cease.

 

[Maxperson]

So one can consume what they dont own (how did they acquire these things...hmm) and then profit off of it?

Will the wonders of the modern lobbyist profession never cease.

Stranger rulings have happened. We do not know how it will turn out. You are assuming, and are probably right. Probably, but not absolutely.

 

[Scribe]

Stranger rulings have happened. We do not know how it will turn out. You are assuming, and are probably right. Probably, but not absolutely.

I'm not really assuming. I personally think that $ is King, and these AI companies have all the money in the world to throw at Governments to get the laws to lean their way.

I also dont care what the laws say, because the reality is, this is not some kid looking at his favourite artist and teaching himself how to draw.

This is a bottomless pit of consumption, automated to rip off everything it possibly can, without compensation or (it would appear) ownership to even access, blending it (poorly it would seem) and then one would assume, looking to profit off of that.

The 'oh well its like you taught yourself by watching others do it' misses the mark in the same way counting on ones fingers is the same as what CERN does.

 

[FrogReaver]

So one can consume what they dont own (how did they acquire these things...hmm) and then profit off of it?

Yea, if you keep adding caveat after caveat you will eventually prove the point about a very specific and niche case that’s only tangentially related to the general case being spoke about. Great job!

Will the wonders of the modern lobbyist profession never cease.

Ignorance is bliss I guess.

I don’t believe these for profit companies will be found to have fair use to sell the copyright infringing content these copyright work using models generate. Though putting the onus on the end user in terms of service to not do that is interesting and could impact other software tools as well if ruled against. Could it mean Microsoft could be held responsible if you use Word to copyright infringe and store the file on their cloud? The legal side is going to be very interesting.

That said I do believe that the work involved in creating the model itself could be deemed fair use on educational/research grounds while some step beyond the creation of the model causes the infringement.

 

[Scribe]

Yea, if you keep adding caveat after caveat you will eventually prove the point about a very specific and niche case that’s only tangentially related to the general case being spoke about. Great job!

Its simply the logical flow, because that absolutely is what has been done.

1. OpenAI have already said 'we couldnt possibly have paid for it, it wouldnt be economically viable' or something to that effect.
2. We already know that content which is under copy right has been straight up ripped, and regurgitated. I think you even did that in another thread with the PHB.
3. There is no way the amount of money going into these companies, is just 'for fun' A profit will be expected out of this eventually.
4. Now we have an OpenAI spokesperson saying that its obfuscated and its on the end user to not try and get at the copyright material?

I dont need to add caveat after caveat. I'm just walking down the path which is clearly there.

They stole, they know they stole, they even programmed the system to try and hide it, and put into ToS that the USERS cannot try and get at that copyrighted material?

I dont really care beyond that.

Did they steal everyone's stuff? Yep.
Will this have a detrimental impact on many people's jobs? Yep.

Thats it, beyond that I dont care. Fair use? Dont care. Legal by the law's of the land? Dont care. "Its just the way it is and look at all these other bad companies." Dont care.

 

[FrogReaver]

Its simply the logical flow, because that absolutely is what has been done.

None of the specific ai stuff applies to your question about consuming something in general and not paying for it being legal.

I absolutely hate the shifting goal posts. And beyond that I guess I don’t really care either.

I dont really care beyond that.

 

[Scribe]

None of the specific ai stuff applies to your question about consuming something in general and not paying for it being legal.

It does though? I'm not asking in a general sense. Pertaining to the topic of the thread (AI) is the mass consumption of the internet, which they do not own, and content that would again generally need to be paid for (PHB for example) in a world in which OpenAI has stated 'we couldnt possibly pay for it all' permissible as fair use?

Its not a goal post shift. Its the point of multiple of these threads.

Did they essentially steal the content of the internet, and stuff that absolutely is not 'public', to train their model?

 

[FrogReaver]

It does though? I'm not asking in a general sense.

You did ask in the general sense though.

Pertaining to the topic of the thread (AI) is the mass consumption of the internet, which they do not own, and content that would again generally need to be paid for (PHB for example) in a world in which OpenAI has stated 'we couldnt possibly pay for it all' permissible as fair use?

Do you know how search engines work? They mass consume the internet! They pull content from nearly everywhere, including a ton of copyrighted material they don't own and put it on the results page whether it's copyrighted or not. Did you know it's been deemed that what they do is perfectly legal? Google couldn't pay for all the material their search engines use either. (well maybe they could now, but definitely not when they started up).

Its not a goal post shift. Its the point of multiple of these threads.

For our particular tangent it was. I'm good dropping that part altogether, but it's still really frustrating when people do that.

Did they essentially steal the content of the internet, and stuff that absolutely is not 'public', to train their model?

It's only theft if it wasn't fair use.

 

[Scribe]

For our particular tangent it was. I'm good dropping that part altogether, but it's still really frustrating when people do that.

I apologize, I was not intending to shift the goal posts. I did not outline it as distinctly as I could have, and so thats on me.