Alternative: Girls (females) in D&D/ Roleplaying

[jonesy]

'Man' includes both old English Wer-men and Wife-men - Males and Females - Men and Wo-Men. The idea that Man/Men is exclusive of Women is very recent.

The middle-ages are recent? The english forms separated between years 1500-1700.

Anyway, you can't justify modern usage of words with the old usage. Or do you still use the word 'girl' to refer to young children of both sexes? That would be akward.

 

[arscott]

Seriously, browse through the romance section...specifically look for historical fantasy novels...and tell me that the way male characters are displayed on the covers are not identical to the way that D&D displays them.

Baloney. Men on the covers of romance novels are prettier, cleaner, and generally slimmer that you're likely to see in a D&D book.

Male D&D characters usually project power. Romance novel characters trade much of that power for grace. The only place you're likely to see that much grace in a male figure in D&D art is with elves--and it's no coincidence that most D&D elf art is female.

 

[ShinHakkaider]

1. Have you or are you willing to (AYWT) make a distinction between the positive portrayal of women in games/ gaming and sexist portrayals?

Depends on whether or not I see something as sexist or not I guess. If I see it as being sexist I probably will, If I dont I wont.


2. Have you or AYWT accept that the consistent use of pictures of bikini-clad women strolling through snowfields alongside rug-wrapped barbarian men is potentially discouraging for some female gamers?

Yes. It's not going to stop me from running or playing the games I want to play but sure I can accept that.

3. Have you or AYWT go out of your way to recruit or encourage girls/ females to join a gaming group?

No. I care about having good players.


4. Have you or AYWT go out of your way to encourage girls/ females to join RPG communities?

Nope. I gotta say though if I WERE going to encourage / target a specific group to play RPG's (not that I'm going to) it would be black and brown people in general male AND female.


5. Have you or AYWT tell a publisher, (by email, blog or f2F), that you'd like to see more positive portrayals of women in RPGs?

Nope. If I find their portrayals of women (or any group for that matter) offensive I simply dont give that publisher my money.


6. Have you or AYWT present youngsters with equal opportunities to get involved in RPGs?

Unfortunately not yet. My 8 year old has shown some interest though...

7. Have you or AYWT adapt rules, settings and gameplay to offer a mix or balance of mystery, exploration, investigation, characterisation and novelty alongside combat-focused gameplay? (Either to encourage all kids equally or females).

All of those things? NO. Some of those things where it fits and isnt forced? Yes.


8. Have you or AYWT adjust your RPG purchasing habits to at least limit sexist content/ contexts?

Nope. If it's offensive to me then I dont buy it. But what you consider sexist and I consider sexist may differ by a wide margin. I dont consider the art in Pathfinder offensive or sexist. But someone in this very thread seems to have taken acception to the dress of one of their iconics. I dont see it.


9. Have you or AYWT actively discourage obvious and persistent sexism at your game table, e.g. don't laugh along with the jokes/ speak up if a female player appears uncomfortable with some of what's being said?

Yes / No, here's why: If what's going on at the table is offensive to me I'm gonna open my mouth and say something. If I say something that in hindsight I feel might have been offensive / insensitive to one of my players, I'll address it and apologize. If something that's going on that the table that's offensive to one of my players, but I dont pick up on it immediately or at all, then THEY need to say something. Everyone's sensitivity to certain things is different.

 

[S'mon]

The middle-ages are recent? .

More like 1990.

 

[jonesy]

More like 1990.

Okay, you just lost me completely. What are you talking about? One moment you're talking about the Wer-men and Wife-men forms, and the next you're three hundred years in the future. It's like there's a whole conversation missing from the middle. Are you talking about the opposition to the usage of man to refer to women? Or what? Throw me a bone, dude.

 

[Umbran]

T

1. Have you or are you willing to (AYWT) make a distinction between the positive portrayal of women in games/ gaming and sexist portrayals?

1. 
   
   Yes, but.... (there's always a, "but")...
   
   I have a small issue with use of the definite article: "...the positive portrayal...". As if there's only one, and someone out there has decided what it is, and Powers help you if you aren't in line with that decision.
   
   If we're about discussion, and coming to realize that sexism and positive portrayals are both complex and subtle beasts, then I'm with you.
   
   

   Y
   Want to make it truly equal? Imagine this picture of Conan the Barbarian: He stands next to the bodies of the dead, twisting his now small waist to present both backside and his chest. His lips are full and slightly parted to shoe both increase sexualized blood flow and shortness of breath. His body is gleaming and oiled without a trace of dirt or grime on it, his hair rich and flowing behind him. His loincloth very obviously stands out from his large and...well. You get the idea.

   
   Well, that'd make them the same depiction. That only makes them equally sexualized if we accept the premise that men and women (as abroad generalization) find the same visual cues sexually attractive.
   
   I think that assumption is weak. I'm not a psychologist, so I cannot point to studies, but that premise runs counter to my personal understanding.

 

[Desdichado]

Am I the only one who has no idea what the acronym (I presume it's an acronym) AYWT is supposed to mean?

EDIT: Ah, nevermind. Read the OP more carefully and got it.

Answers forthcoming...

Have you or are you willing to (AYWT) make a distinction between the positive portrayal of women in games/ gaming and sexist portrayals?

I'm not 100% sure what this question is asking. Am I willing to classify depictions of women by how sexist I think they are? Frankly, I'm not that interested in the isssue.

Have you or AYWT accept that the consistent use of pictures of bikini-clad women strolling through snowfields alongside rug-wrapped barbarian men is potentially discouraging for some female gamers?

I think it's a moot point, because I don't accept the assumption that those kinds of pictures are really all that consistant. I can't remember seeing one in years.

Have you or AYWT go out of your way to recruit or encourage girls/ females to join a gaming group?

I go out of my way to recruit and encourage people who I think will be fun to game with. There have been some women and girls in that list of people, but I've never done so specifically because they were women. That would indeed have been sexist.

Have you or AYWT go out of your way to encourage girls/ females to join RPG communities?

No. Then again, I've never gone out of my way to encourage anyone to join an RPG community.

Have you or AYWT tell a publisher, (by email, blog or f2F), that you'd like to see more positive portrayals of women in RPGs?

No, I have no interest in contacting any publisher over this issue.

Have you or AYWT present youngsters with equal opportunities to get involved in RPGs?

No, I haven't. Unless you count "separate but equal" opportunities. Frankly, the kinds of games I play in and enjoy most are ones that are probably not really appropriate for youngsters to play in. I wouldn't invite my kids to play with my regular group. I would, however, (and do, on occasion) run other games specifically for them, and so do some of the other guys in the group who have kids old enough to appreciate the game.

Have you or AYWT adapt rules, settings and gameplay to offer a mix or balance of mystery, exploration, investigation, characterisation and novelty alongside combat-focused gameplay? (Either to encourage all kids equally or females).

Yes, I do that... but not to encourage kids or females. Frankly, I run games the way I like them, and then try to make sure that my group is like-minded enough to like it too.

Have you or AYWT adjust your RPG purchasing habits to at least limit sexist content/ contexts?

That has never been a decision factor in any single RPG purchase I've ever made.

Have you or AYWT actively discourage obvious and persistent sexism at your game table, e.g. don't laugh along with the jokes/ speak up if a female player appears uncomfortable with some of what's being said?

Moot point. I've never been at a table where that was a problem.

 

[Raven Crowking]

deleted

 

[jasin]

[*] Have you or AYWT tell a publisher, (by email, blog or f2F), that you'd like to see more positive portrayals of women in RPGs?
Yes. Most recently, I added my voice to a choir suggesting that the way Seoni was represented in Pathfinder seemed very different than other characters, encouraged stereotypes associated with eating disorders, and appeared not only impractical for adventuring, but as a fantasy character, just didn't look powerful and credible. The staff basically rolled their eyes and engaged in some light, privileged mockery.

What does "light, privileged mockery" mean?

 

[Dragonbait]

1. Have you or are you willing to (AYWT) make a distinction between the positive portrayal of women in games/ gaming and sexist portrayals? Until recently I've hadn't thought about it. But after observing the "wide" array of female personalities in most games I tried to make more female NPCs in positions other than damsels in distress and busty barmaids.

2. Have you or AYWT accept that the consistent use of pictures of bikini-clad women strolling through snowfields alongside rug-wrapped barbarian men is potentially discouraging for some female gamers? I've laughed at those. I don't mind the bikini-clad women strolling through the snowfields alongside loincloth barbarians.

3. Have you or AYWT go out of your way to recruit or encourage girls/ females to join a gaming group? Encourage, yes.

4. Have you or AYWT go out of your way to encourage girls/ females to join RPG communities? Not females in particular.

5. Have you or AYWT tell a publisher, (by email, blog or f2F), that you'd like to see more positive portrayals of women in RPGs? I'd say yes, but I know I have never done so, so I'd be lying.

6. Have you or AYWT present youngsters with equal opportunities to get involved in RPGs? Absolutely. I'm going to try to introduce my niece to gaming once she is old enough!

7. Have you or AYWT adapt rules, settings and gameplay to offer a mix or balance of mystery, exploration, investigation, characterisation and novelty alongside combat-focused gameplay? (Either to encourage all kids equally or females). No in regards to catering supposed gender preferences. I try to make settings diverse by default.

8. Have you or AYWT adjust your RPG purchasing habits to at least limit sexist content/ contexts? Unfortunately, no. I have purchased some books after I looked through and laughed at the women's armor design.. I feel like if I start doing that, I'd never be able to buy ANY fantasy game product..

[*] Have you or AYWT actively discourage obvious and persistent sexism at your game table, e.g. don't laugh along with the jokes/ speak up if a female player appears uncomfortable with some of what's being said? I'll try?