Angel Finale

[Hand of Evil]

You don't mean... Danny Bonaduce!?!?!?!

Someone just chop Lorne up into spinach NOW.

Seriously, I could see it. Lorne, softie that he is, seems like the type prone to vary manic swings. He'd be super-guy for several episodes, and extremely hurt and dejected the next. Lorne ultimately needs music in his heart, and a crowd to play to. Hopefully, his character found it in the end.

It does make you wonder if Lorne saw it coming, Linsey sung for him many times.

 

[Cthulhudrew]

... Joss had a bad habit of keeping characters around too long and forced relationships that did not fit. Harmony is the most recent example. Why would Angel ever hire her or allow her to keep her job???? ...

Well, Angel didn't hire her (she was already in the W&H steno pool), he just allowed her to continue working for him so that he could keep an eye on her. I know, why not just stake her? Dunno, but to say that the gang had to make a lot of compromises this season in order to get at some of the bigger evils, they had to bite the bullet and work with lesser evils. It was one of the big themes, and the reason Lorne left in the end. Same reason Angel was willing to work with Lindsey at the end ("Better the devil you know?")

And it worked out for him in the end, after all. He counted on Harmony's evil to "betray" him to Hamilton, so that Hamilton would come after him at the end and confront him at W&H. Worked according to plan. Good thing Harmony's alarming bent towards good this season turned out to be just another "trendy" thing for her to do and didn't really take.

 

[Rackhir]

Actually, I see him becoming an alcholic and addict... perhaps hanging out with the wrong crowd of celebrities. The events of this season just broke him. He started drinking after they lost Fred and I see him going in more of a downward spiral with all the events that happened after.

I enjoyed the ending, but was a bit disapointed. Most likely, it's just because it's the end, but a few things seemed a bit off to me.
Like, when did Wes started throwing around flaming balls of magical force. He was the guy to go to for things magical, but usually he was reading his spells from a book.
That's the one that stands out at least. Otherwise, it had great action, great dialog, and things that I just didn't see coming.

I would tend to agree with you, except that there are things (especially) with magic that you can get away with once, because the price is too high or too difficult to pay to use them more often than that.

Also, remember Wes's attacks were essentially ineffective against the wizard, however sucessful they may have appeared at first. It was Illyria who actually killed him, so it's not like he suddenly became uber-wizard. I wonder if that is something else that Angel was counting on...

I agree totally with you about Lorne, though. He was a broken demon at the end of the show. Having to kill Lindsey in cold blood like that I suspect is what was the final straw, though he's been heading rapidly downhill since Fred died. She was the only person who was essentially happy in Angel's little band and picking up on her vibes probably helped keep him going, especially at WRH.

 

[frandelgearslip]

I am glad somebody else started this thread and not me because I was planning on calling it "Joss Whedon can go **** himself".

Seriously when I saw the episode all I can think of was "12 seasons and he ends it like that?"

First off the fact that they don't kill evil beings because they make interesting characters (like harmony, drusilla, etc.) finally comes and hurts them and they don't bother to kill harmony because obviously they have not learned there lesson.

Lorne kills lyndsey for no reason that makes any sense to me. Essentially he kills him because the writers wanted him dead but they could not be bothered to come up with something that makes sense.

Then they kill off wesley just making him the third cast member to be killed off this season, come on this is just overkill. I wouldn't have minded if they had killed him off during the third season when his throat was slashed, but this just pisses me off. Its like when they killed of Anya. They think last episode somebody needs to die, but they don't bother to kill off anybody surprising, its ridiculous. Besides its not like he is one of the unluckiest characters in the history of television, stop picking on him kill somebody else like Gunn or better yet Spike.

Then of course they don't even bother ending the episode because its not like its the final episode ever.

Joss Whedon (and David Greenwalt) go **** yourselves

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

On Harmony: it's a "devil you know" kind of situation, combined with the fact that if they got rid of her, the Senior Partners might find someone competent to spy on Angel. Angel never really bought any of her professed repenting - heck, he had already written her letter of recommendation and put it on the desk for her before she betrayed him.

 

[myrdden]

On Harmony: it's a "devil you know" kind of situation, combined with the fact that if they got rid of her, the Senior Partners might find someone competent to spy on Angel. Angel never really bought any of her professed repenting - heck, he had already written her letter of recommendation and put it on the desk for her before she betrayed him.

Also I think the group didn't really consider Harmony a threat, so why bother going after such a little fish when there were much bigger, badder fish all around them.

 

[Cthulhudrew]

First off the fact that they don't kill evil beings because they make interesting characters (like harmony, drusilla, etc.) finally comes and hurts them and they don't bother to kill harmony because obviously they have not learned there lesson.

If you're referring to Harmony's betrayal of Angel in this episode as evidence of it "coming back to bite them" you may have missed the subtext that- *that was exactly what Angel had planned*. He *knew* she would betray him, and so he used that fact, by having her "occupy" Hamilton. Thus, Hamilton shows up at W&H thinking to stop Angel from killing Sebassis. But Angel had already killed Sebassis, and he was waiting around at W&H specifically for Hamilton. He relied on Harm's evil to enact a situation that he wanted.

Lorne kills lyndsey for no reason that makes any sense to me. Essentially he kills him because the writers wanted him dead but they could not be bothered to come up with something that makes sense.

Let me get this straight- you hate that the Fang Gang *doesn't* kill off evil beings when they get the chance, leaving them to come back and bite them, *then* you get upset when they *do* kill off the bad guys? I don't follow the reasoning.

Lorne killed Lindsey because Lindsey was a bad guy. He's been a bad guy (with brief twinges of goodness) since episode 1. Now, whether Lorne killed Lindsey on Angel's orders or did it himself is debatable (and deliciously so), but make no mistake. It was done so that he wouldn't just pick up where W&H's "Inner Circle" failed.

Then of course they don't even bother ending the episode because its not like its the final episode ever.

They did end the episode. They ended it with the gang doing what they've dedicated their lives to doing- fighting off the bad guys. Angel even gets to be the champion "white knight" by fighting the evil dragon.

This is one of the best series finales since Newhart.

 

[myrdden]

Seriously when I saw the episode all I can think of was "12 seasons and he ends it like that?"

Angel was only on for 5 seasons. Adding the Buffy seasons is like saying Cheers has been on for 20 seasons.

First off the fact that they don't kill evil beings because they make interesting characters (like harmony, drusilla, etc.) finally comes and hurts them and they don't bother to kill harmony because obviously they have not learned there lesson.

I don't see where it hurt them. If you are referring to Harmony, Angel was well aware of her potential for betrayal and used to his advantage against Hamilton (not that it was a great advantage, but it did move events in the direction Angel wanted).

Lorne kills lyndsey for no reason that makes any sense to me. Essentially he kills him because the writers wanted him dead but they could not be bothered to come up with something that makes sense.

It does make sense though. If anything, the writers left it vague enough so that viewers can speculate what Lindsay's death was. Was it part of Angel's plan to remove a potentially powerful player from taking over Wolfram & Hart and bring some justice to Lindsay? Or was it Lorne taking his own action against someone he really despised? Personnaly, I think it was Angel who called the shot (so to speak). The writers definitiely didn't spell out every single detail but like a connect the dot puzzle, the pieces were all there waiting for the viewer to "connect the dots" and fill in the big picture. I personally think it worked out rather well.

Then they kill off wesley just making him the third cast member to be killed off this season, come on this is just overkill. I wouldn't have minded if they had killed him off during the third season when his throat was slashed, but this just pisses me off. Its like when they killed of Anya. They think last episode somebody needs to die, but they don't bother to kill off anybody surprising, its ridiculous. Besides its not like he is one of the unluckiest characters in the history of television, stop picking on him kill somebody else like Gunn or better yet Spike.

Wesley was probably the best developed and most interesting character on the show. I wasn't too thrilled with his death since he was my favourite character but I do not think it was overkill. Would Gunn's or Spike's death be anymore surprising? Wesley was the tragic hero of the group and his death really did bring his character evolution full circle. I would have liked to have seen a more powerful ending for him, but it was only an hour show filled wiht lots to accomplish.

Definitely Anya's death in the final for Buffy was lame. Actually, the deathitself wasn't so lame as it was the reaction to it. Especially Xander's. Wes' exit was not like this at all. They all knew there was very little chance for all of them to make to the alley.

Joss Whedon (and David Greenwalt) go **** yourselves

That's a whole lotta hat.

 

[myrdden]

This is one of the best series finales since Newhart.

D'OH...you posted much faster than I did.

I don't know about Newhart (didn't see it) but I will say it was one of the best finales I have ever seen.

 

[Cthulhudrew]

D'OH...you posted much faster than I did.

Haha. That's why they call me Quick Draw.

I don't know about Newhart (didn't see it) but I will say it was one of the best finales I have ever seen.

In the finale to Newhart, Dick wakes up in bed with his wife, Emily- you know, from the Bob Newhart show? Turns out the whole "Newhart" series was just a dream of Bob Hartley (his character on the Bob Newhart show). Funny stuff.

I think I remember hearing that Hill Street Blues turned out to be the dream of an idiot savant or something, as well. Never saw that, though.