Best Warrior/Mage Combos

[Elder-Basilisk]

seeing as with all that magic (which I would also never allow for a non-epic) you ain't no 17th level character. You shoudl ahve some risk that any opponent can take you down - if you can actually do all this (or just plain allowed to - outside the RAW) I don't see that happening with the EL's for 17th level

All what magic?

The required items for this:
Boots of speed (11,000 gp)
A weapon. Free if you pick a normal quarterstaff, but of course the more money you spend the better a weapon you can get.
A focus for contingency (1,500gp)

That's it. (This kind of a character is actually easier to pull off in a low-magic item game than a traditional fighter because he brings his own magic to the table).

By the book, however, a 17th level character who doesn't do any crafting can expect to have 360,000gp or so to play with.
+1 holy adamantine guisarme of wounding (53,000)
+1 ghost touch, undead bane light flail (18,300)
+6 headband of intellect (36,000)
+6 amulet of health (16,000)
+4 gloves of dexterity (36,000)
+6 belt of giant strength (36,000)
+5 ring of protection (50,000)
ring of counterspells (4,000)
+1 animated mithral buckler (10,000)
boots of speed (11,000)
+1 heavy fortification mithral chain shirt (37,000)
lesser rod of extend spell (3000)
metamagic rod of empower spell (32,000 or so)
+4 vest of resistance (16,000)

That's pretty much exactly 360,000gp and should make the character work even better. (Of course, my character doesn't have all that stuff--he's got a +4 ring of protection, moderate fortification mithral chain shirt, +4 amulet of health, +4 belt of strength, etc).

As for risk and appropriate ELs, did I mention that wraithstrike doesn't belong in the game? Wraithstrike is the REALLY abusive bit of the puzzle (as can be demonstrated by the fact that anywhere it shows up, the game break like eggshells in an auto wreck). However, the non-wraithstrike version still works pretty darn well. Not unchallengably well, but pretty well--on a par with a well built fighter/barbarian/prestige class mutt or a melee cleric.

Also, the character has a number of weaknesses (like any other character) and a ring of counterspells can only cover so many of them at a time. The big spells to fear are power word blind, targetted greater dispelling, reaving dispel, and reciprocal gyre (surprisingly, will saves are not a strong suit for this build (Eldritch Knight is strong fort, weak reflex and weak will and it accounts for most of the character's levels so you really need to watch out for that one).

 

[robomage]

My current character is a warforged (with mithral body feat) fighter 1 / warmage 5. I am planning to go eldritch knight after taking my 6th level of warmage. This would make my character fighter 1 / warmage 6 / eldritch knight x. By 20th level I am looking at fighter 1 / warmage 9 / edritch knight 10. My character is effective in melee combat with his greataxe and he is also the groups combat spell caster.

 

[Mistwell]

Greater Shadow Conjuration mimicking Create Magic Tattoo.

Are you implying that you can have more than 3 tats by using shadow conjuation to do it?

 

[Mistwell]

I wouldn't allow Greater Shadow Conjuration to mimic Create Magic Tattoo since CMT does not create an object, creature, or force as per Shadow Conjuration. It creates an effect (one that cannot be saved against for disbelief). Your DM is letting you slide with that one.

Then you might want to re-read the spell Shadow Conjuation. Not only can you create an effect with it, but that is spelled out specifically in the spell.

You can create ANY conjuation (creation) spell. There are different rules for how it works with different spells you are mimicing, but you can mimic ANY of them. That's the point of the spell.

 

[KarinsDad]

Are you implying that you can have more than 3 tats by using shadow conjuation to do it?

No, just one tattoo to get the +1 Caster Level.

The Ring of Arcane Might gives him his other +1 Caster Level.

 

[Mistwell]

No, just one tattoo to get the +1 Caster Level.

The Ring of Arcane Might gives him his other +1 Caster Level.

I'm not sure I understand the advantage to using Shadow Conjuation to do it then, unless it's a matter of "I don't have to have Magical Tattoo on my Known Spells List". If that's the case, then it makes perfect sense.

 

[KarinsDad]

Then you might want to re-read the spell Shadow Conjuation. Not only can you create an effect with it, but that is spelled out specifically in the spell.

You can create ANY conjuation (creation) spell. There are different rules for how it works with different spells you are mimicing, but you can mimic ANY of them. That's the point of the spell.

You use material from the Plane of Shadow to shape quasi-real illusions of one or more creatures, objects, or forces. Shadow conjuration can mimic any sorcerer or wizard conjuration (summoning) or conjuration (creation) spell of 3rd level or lower.

Shadow conjurations are actually one-fifth (20%) as strong as the real things, though creatures who believe the shadow conjurations to be real are affected by them at full strength.

Any creature that interacts with the conjured object, force, or creature can make a Will save to recognize its true nature.

Yes, I know it says "any". I bolded it here.

It also says "object, force, or creature". It says it twice.

The problem is that when you go into some of the non-core books, the Conjuration spells start to do amazing things outside the real realm of Conjuration (like adds to saves, adds to caster level, giving spell resistance, etc.).

Conjuration

Each conjuration spell belongs to one of five subschools. Conjurations bring manifestations of objects, creatures, or some form of energy to you (the summoning subschool), actually transport creatures from another plane of existence to your plane (calling), heal (healing), transport creatures or objects over great distances (teleportation), or create objects or effects on the spot (creation). Creatures you conjure usually, but not always, obey your commands.

A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it. The creature or object must appear within the spell’s range, but it does not have to remain within the range.

Calling: A calling spell transports a creature from another plane to the plane you are on. The spell grants the creature the one-time ability to return to its plane of origin, although the spell may limit the circumstances under which this is possible. Creatures who are called actually die when they are killed; they do not disappear and reform, as do those brought by a summoning spell (see below). The duration of a calling spell is instantaneous, which means that the called creature can’t be dispelled.

Creation: A creation spell manipulates matter to create an object or creature in the place the spellcaster designates (subject to the limits noted above). If the spell has a duration other than instantaneous, magic holds the creation together, and when the spell ends, the conjured creature or object vanishes without a trace. If the spell has an instantaneous duration, the created object or creature is merely assembled through magic. It lasts indefinitely and does not depend on magic for its existence.

Healing: Certain divine conjurations heal creatures or even bring them back to life.

Summoning: A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower. It is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can’t be summoned again.

When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have, and it refuses to cast any spells that would cost it XP, or to use any spell-like abilities that would cost XP if they were spells.

Teleportation: A teleportation spell transports one or more creatures or objects a great distance. The most powerful of these spells can cross planar boundaries. Unlike summoning spells, the transportation is (unless otherwise noted) one-way and not dispellable. Teleportation is instantaneous travel through the Astral Plane. Anything that blocks astral travel also blocks teleportation.

Nowhere here does it mention other types of spell effects like adding +1 to caster level. You'll note that the core spells do not do this.

It is a loophole because somebody made Create Tattoo a Conjuration Creation spell as opposed to a Transmutation spell. He probably did this cause he put the word Create in the spell name.

But, it is a loophole that can be easily closed by a judicious reading of Shadow Conjuration.

Or, you could understand that Create Tattoo is not really a Conjuration Creation spell (based on the definition of Conjuration Creation) and change it to Transmutation (similar to Magic Fang which gives a bonus). Course, it has Transmutation elements and Adjuration elements (e.g. Spell Resistance). That tends to happen with the overly versatile "one spell does all" attempts.

It does not create an object, creature, or force. It adds one of several different types of bonuses. That is not conjuration.

 

[KarinsDad]

I'm not sure I understand the advantage to using Shadow Conjuation to do it then, unless it's a matter of "I don't have to have Magical Tattoo on my Known Spells List". If that's the case, then it makes perfect sense.

That's the reason.

 

[Mistwell]

Yes, I know it says "any". I bolded it here.

It also says "object, force, or creature". It says it twice.

The problem is that when you go into some of the non-core books, the Conjuration spells start to do amazing things outside the real realm of Conjuration (like adds to saves, adds to caster level, giving spell resistance, etc.).



Nowhere here does it mention other types of spell effects like adding +1 to caster level. You'll note that the core spells do not do this.

It is a loophole because somebody made Create Tattoo a Conjuration Creation spell as opposed to a Transmutation spell. He probably did this cause he put the word Create in the spell name.

But, it is a loophole that can be easily closed by a judicious reading of Shadow Conjuration.

Or, you could understand that Create Tattoo is not really a Conjuration Creation spell (based on the definition of Conjuration Creation) and change it to Transmutation (similar to Magic Fang which gives a bonus). Course, it has Transmutation elements and Adjuration elements (e.g. Spell Resistance). That tends to happen with the overly versatile "one spell does all" attempts.

It does not create an object, creature, or force. It adds one of several different types of bonuses. That is not conjuration.

quote the rest of the spell, and i am sure you will see it. not to mention a tattoo is either an object or a force (of a magical nature).

You want a house rule. That's fine. But lets not pretend it's RAW. You can clearly replicate any Conjuation (Creation) spell. Period.

 

[KarinsDad]

quote the rest of the spell, and i am sure you will see it. not to mention a tattoo is either an object or a force (of a magical nature).

You want a house rule. That's fine. But lets not pretend it's RAW. You can clearly replicate any Conjuation (Creation) spell. Period.

If you want to illustrate a point, you quote rules. Don't expect me to illustrate your point for you.

I've already illustrated that Shadow Conjuration limits the type of Conjuration Creation spells to ones that create creatures, objects, or forces if you take a strict reading of it (course, all Conjuration Creation spells are supposed to do that already).

Compulsion Creation spells do not create effects on creatures. You want that to happen in your game, great. You want to allow a typo in a FR book in your game, great. You want the tattoo itself to be "the object" in your game, great. But, that does not mean that one sentence in the rules overrides all of the others and is RAW in and of itself in a vacuum. You have to read the other sentences in the spell, the rest of the rules on magic, and you have to understand what Conjuration Creation means.