D&D (2024) Can I get Armor of Agathys without being a Warlock?

[Lakesidefantasy]

Oh, I see. The intention is to make it very challenging to find the perfect mix of feats, classes, items, and spells to get near permanent, rechargeable Armor of Agathys then. Kudos to the development team for creating this exciting puzzle for us to solve. I can't wait to see it in action at the table. Love it.

 

[Ashrym]

Oh, I see. The intention is to make it very challenging to find the perfect mix of feats, classes, items, and spells to get near permanent, rechargeable Armor of Agathys then. Kudos to the development team for creating this exciting puzzle for us to solve. I can't wait to see it in action at the table. Love it.

Considering how hard it is to get Armor of Agathys outside of playing a warlock and the fact it's not OP trying to porcupine with the spell it doesn't seem like much of an issue.

 

[ECMO3]

That was true of 2014-5e because most of the higher level martial class features were flat out bad, and so it was far better to multiclass out and get the core kit of two classes than keep going in one. I don't know if that's still true in Revised 5e.

It was and still is mechanically more powerful to take only a few non-caster levels (typically 1 level). The divide is wider in the 2024 rules because the things martials get at 1st level are substantially more powerful now. So your caster can take a 1-level dip to pick up either:

3 weapon masteries, martial weapons, a Fighting Style Feat, and Second Wind (Fighter)

OR

2 weapon masteries, plus martial weapons and some other ribbons without losing a caster level (Ranger or Paladin)

OR

a Bonus Action unarmed strike doing 1d6+Dex, plus unarmored defense plus get a d6 damage for all the crappy simple weapons they are proficient in (Monk)

This all on a single level dip.

 

[ECMO3]

Oh, I see. The intention is to make it very challenging to find the perfect mix of feats, classes, items, and spells to get near permanent, rechargeable Armor of Agathys then. Kudos to the development team for creating this exciting puzzle for us to solve. I can't wait to see it in action at the table. Love it.

Not that hard. An Undead Warlock would be a start. After that any full caster would probably provide enough slots to maintain it topped up. A Glamour Bard in particular would dominate this.

Such a character could "top up" using a bonus action with Mantle of Inspiration Charisma times per short rest plus using Form of Dread PB times per day. So with a 20 Charisma at level 6 that is 5 times per short rest and 3 times a day as a bonus action. That is probably more than you are going to need.

The AOA spell only lasts an hour though, so even if you still have temp hit points from another source the ability to damage enemies goes away.

 

[Ashrym]

Not that hard. An Undead Warlock would be a start. After that any full caster would probably provide enough slots to maintain it topped up. A Glamour Bard in particular would dominate this.

Such a character could "top up" using a bonus action with Mantle of Inspiration Charisma times per short rest plus using Form of Dread PB times per day. So with a 20 Charisma at level 6 that is 5 times per short rest and 3 times a day as a bonus action. That is probably more than you are going to need.

The AOA spell only lasts an hour though, so even if you still have temp hit points from another source the ability to damage enemies goes away.

Mantle of Inspiration only works on others and costs bardic inspiration uses. The college was significantly changed in 2024.

 

[mellored]

Well it can be special for Warlocks, but all that really means is my Dance Bard is going to have a Warlock level (actually two levels because Agonizing Blast-Truestrike is unique to Warlocks too).

True strike doesn't work for unarmed attacks. Not that I would see any issue with allowing it.

It also won't work for the bonus action attacks.

 

[mellored]

Is this the new rules exploit? I read something earlier about Armor of Agathys being rechargeable due to a change in language regarding temporary hot points.

Exploit thus far are...
Two weapon fighting with 1 hand.
Upcast Conjure Minor Elementals × Scorching Ray (not an issue at low levels)
Conjure Minor Elementals × Eldritch Blast + Quicken (+ Action Surge+Haste)
Divine Intervention + Hallow
Readying movement + Spirit Guardians (more reliable than before).
Spiked Growth + grapple + speed (not new)
Sorcerer Points + Warlock slots (not new).


I don't see armor of agythis as an exploit.

 

[Mistwell]

I think that depends on the single class you are talking about. Most multiclass builds outpace non-casters I think, more like 9 in 10.

I am not finding that to be the case in 2024

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Not that hard. An Undead Warlock would be a start. After that any full caster would probably provide enough slots to maintain it topped up. A Glamour Bard in particular would dominate this.

Such a character could "top up" using a bonus action with Mantle of Inspiration Charisma times per short rest plus using Form of Dread PB times per day. So with a 20 Charisma at level 6 that is 5 times per short rest and 3 times a day as a bonus action. That is probably more than you are going to need.

The AOA spell only lasts an hour though, so even if you still have temp hit points from another source the ability to damage enemies goes away.

I don't think that's going to work all that well in practice. Neither Mantle of Inspiration nor Form of Dread give enough temp HP to reliably absorb a round of attacks from a level appropriate monster, or even a single attack much of the time, and once you have no THP the spell ends. You might be able to trigger the damage from AoA once or twice more per casting, which is nice but not really worth centering a build around.

 

[Ashrym]

I don't think that's going to work all that well in practice. Neither Mantle of Inspiration nor Form of Dread give enough temp HP to reliably absorb a round of attacks from a level appropriate monster, or even a single attack much of the time, and once you have no THP the spell ends. You might be able to trigger the damage from AoA once or twice more per casting, which is nice but not really worth centering a build around.

I think Form of Dread might be good for a bit at high levels. 1d10 plus warlock level isn't that bad depending on the opponents.

Mantle of Inspiration doesn't work at all.

Level 3: Mantle of Inspiration​

You can weave fey magic into a song or dance to fill others with vigor. As a Bonus Action, you can expend a use of Bardic Inspiration, rolling a Bardic Inspiration die. When you do so, choose a number of other creatures within 60 feet of yourself, up to a number equal to your Charisma modifier (minimum of one creature). Each of those creatures gains a number of Temporary Hit Points equal to two times the number rolled on the Bardic Inspiration die, and then each can use its Reaction to move up to its Speed without provoking Opportunity Attacks.

I bolded and underlined the problem part. The ability specifically calls out that other creatures are the target. The thp are going to add up over time as they are used, sure, and they won't typically grant enough to power Armor of Agathys like you say, but the fact Mantle of Inspiration doesn't allow for targeting oneself make that moot.

What makes Mantle of Inspiration good is it also grants off-turn movement as a reaction in addition to thp.