Changes to Devils and Demons

[AdmundfortGeographer]

I don;t see why D&D developers must be shackled to Planescape or the Great Wheel cosmology forever. Now is as good a time as any to try something new.

Or maybe they could bring back and update the Five Spheres cosmology of BECMI. Personally, I always felt it offered greater freedom for random Joe World-Builder.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I'm under impression that most people on these boards just hate Planescape... 0.o

Nope - Planescape: Torment is one of my favorite games of all time, almost specifically because of the setting. I like Planescape in general, I like thinking about the Blood War and how to involve my players in it; heck, I even like the names tanar'ri and baatezu ...

... But I also really, really like Eberron, which basically gives PS the finger.

I just don't see why the Planescape arrangement of the multiverse should be more "core" than any other.

 

[Shade]

I don;t see why D&D developers must be shackled to Planescape or the Great Wheel cosmology forever. Now is as good a time as any to try something new.

Speaking to the Great Wheel cosmology, for the same reason they're shackled to fireball, lightning bolt, frost brands, Tiamat, Lolth, bulettes, mind flayers, and so on...

That is the D&D experience.

Sure, you can vary it up in different campaign settings and lines, but that is, and probably always will be in the minds of most people, the shared experience that sets D&D apart from other games.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Speaking to the Great Wheel cosmology, for the same reason they're shackled to fireball, lightning bolt, frost brands, Tiamat, Lolth, bulettes, mind flayers, and so on...

All of those things you mentioned existed before the Great Wheel.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I, too, dug Planescape.

I also dug the 1980s run of Amazing and Spectacular Spider-Man comics, with the Roxxon Oil storyline, and Punisher as an actual villain, Silvermane, my favorite forgotten villain the Answer, Cloak & Dagger, Black Cat as Spidey's girlfriend, MJ returning and saying she knew Peter's secret, the Hobgoblin storyline ...

But I just don't think Spider-Man should be required to be the 1980s Spider-Man for the rest of time.

While I certainly empathize with folks really upset about this -- I find elevating Asmodeous says more about the quality of the previous evil gods the game has, rather than being a good idea on its own, even if Paizo was already doing the same thing -- I would rather see Ultimate Planescape in two years, rather than Planescape: The Reunion Special.

I'd like to see the best concepts brought back -- and brought to the fore -- and I'd like the stuff that didn't work, because every setting has them, retooled.

Yes, the best writers and DMs can take the awful stuff and polish it and make it great. And that would be fine if there were only best writers and DMs out there. But there aren't.

 

[Shade]

All of those things you mentioned existed before the Great Wheel.

Not by much. The Great Wheel's been around since 1e. Many of its planes were listed inthe 1e Monster Manual. Did Lolth precede it?

 

[frankthedm]

Or maybe they could bring back and update the Five Spheres cosmology of BECMI. Personally, I always felt it offered greater freedom for random Joe World-Builder.

I'm kind of hoping Wotc dusts off some material form Chessboards:The Planes of Possibility from Primal Order

 

[Wormwood]

Speaking to the Great Wheel cosmology, for the same reason they're shackled to fireball, lightning bolt, frost brands, Tiamat, Lolth, bulettes, mind flayers, and so on.

I don't see any of those as sacrosanct when it comes to a revision like this. Fold, spindle and mutilate into a batter game as needed.

(And stuff like Planetars and the Happy Hunting Grounds are nowhere *near* as iconic as the venerable Fireball.)

 

[frankthedm]

oops

 

[Glyfair]

I'm under impression that most people on these boards just hate Planescape... 0.o

It's very popular. Personally, I don't hate the setting. What I don't like is that a vocal portion of the fans keep pushing that it should be the default for D&D. Some of them even want to shoehorn it into every single setting.