cheesy things to do with 2wf

[Sil]

EDIT: Sil said it much better than me.

Thank you

 

[Hypersmurf]

His ruling does not address temporal issues. In your description you are always taking your highest attack first, at the moment you take it.

No, not at all. Because if my first shot had failed to kill the wizard, I would have fired my second shot at the wizard as well, not at the minion.

I didn't decide what to do with my second shot until after I saw the result of my first shot. Therefore the second shot - the higher bonus, in this situation - could not have happened first.

-Hyp.

 

[the Jester]

If it was "a readied opponent" then you did not get your first attack, right?

Maybe. Change the example a touch: What if I slay one enemy on my first attack, then 5' step between attacks and then trigger the readied attack? There are lots of ways for this to come up.

 

[Eldragon]

I fail to see the problem with this use of TWF. Every week there is a topic about how TWF is worse than using two hands on a weapon. Someone has found a great loophole that makes TWF characters get a little extra damage for the first round of combat.

If I were to ever use this tactic, I would use haste, true strike, and power attack.

 

[Len]

I don't see the problem either. It's not that much of a bonus, it requires the Quickdraw feat, and there's still the TWF penalty. If you can drop or draw a weapon as a free action, you should be able to half-drop a weapon as a free action.

 

[Sil]

I didn't decide what to do with my second shot until after I saw the result of my first shot. Therefore the second shot - the higher bonus, in this situation - could not have happened first.

As i understand what you are describing, at any point during the flow of time through the round you are always choosing to attack your target with your highest attack. The fact that events unfold to cause the attack bonus to go up and down is not relavant, because the ruling is when you attack any one target, you use your highest attack bonus for that target first.

How have I misunderstood you?

 

[Hypersmurf]

As i understand what you are describing, at any point during the flow of time through the round you are always choosing to attack your target with your highest attack. The fact that events unfold to cause the attack bonus to go up and down is not relavant, because the ruling is when you attack any one target, you use your highest attack bonus for that target first.

So are you referring to Base Attack Bonus, rather than Total Attack Bonus?

Note that Alzrius specifically referred to Total Attack Bonus, which takes into account all modifiers.

-Hyp.

 

[Bryan898]

I think the RAW don't disallow this, but it's basically trying to take an advantage of loopholes. It's nowhere near the intent of the rules IMO. Also, it would seem to be a terrible ineffective way of fighting in real life in my opinion, and there I see a roleplaying snag. Then again I see the same problem with a greatsword and spiked armor, a greatsword gives you the advantage of reach over a smaller weapon, and you'd want to get close why?

Besides role-playing and loophole reasons, I don't see why it's a problem. He's only getting .5 STR more on that first attack. Then comes the next round, and to do the same maneuver he has to either A.) Drop the shortsword and draw another one, or B.) Sheath the sword, which is a move action that provokes an AoO (pg 141 PHb).

 

[the Jester]

Now, personally, I would rule that, in order to use two-weapon fighting you must accept the 'on-hand penalties' beginning with the first attack you make in the round.

So, to answer my own questions:

1. What if my greataxe (two-handed weapon) is sundered by a readied opponent after my first attack, and I quickdraw a dagger to finish my full attack?

2. On a related note: if I am fighting with two weapons and one is sundered in the midst of my full attack, am I still subject to the two-weapon penalties?

3. Can I drop my remaining weapon (free action) and quickdraw a greatsword (two-handed weapon, free action to draw) and finish my full attack with it? What two-weapon fighting penalties, if any, should I suffer?

1. I can use the dagger, but my Power Attack becomes useless for generating bonus damage because I am now attacking with a light weapon. On the other hand, my declared Power Attack still affects my attack roll.

2. Yes, I am.

3. Yes, I can draw my greatsword and finish my full attack, but I only get attacks for my on-hand weapon (there is no off-hand weapon in use). If I am Power Attacking, I get the bonus for using a weapon in two hands. I still suffer the two-weapon fighting penalties because I started the round with them.

By the same token, if I full attack, and then at the end of my turn drop my greatsword and quickdraw two weapons, I don't start suffering two-weapon fighting penalties until I actually fight with two weapons (you can hold a dagger in your off-hand without suffering any attack penalties as long as you don't try to fight with it).

 

[Storyteller01]

My take: since the player didn't declare using TWF at the begining of the round he doesn't get the extra attack from that feat. If you don't take the -2 penalty, you don't get the benefit. If you have multiple attacks via high BaB, feel free ot use any weapons on your person.