Cloak of Mage Armor

[Slaved]

Since you proposed Bracers of Armor +4 costing 1000 and progress as normal, that means that every thing but chain shirt and mithral breast blate (unless you have crazy dex then those are not worth it either) are the only light armors anyone would use. This is because a +1 Studded Leather provides +4 armor but has the restrictions of armor and does not protect against incorporials.

In my experience this is True with the System currently. Once there is enough Money in the equation the only Light Armors in use are Chain Shirts and Mithral Breastplates with the occasional Darkleaf Breastplate.

Making the change I proposed or not does not change this.

I also do not see Characters with Hide Armor, Scale Mail Armor, or Splint Mail Armor after the first few Levels either.

You compare the cost of the bracers to class abilities. This is not a fair comparison. It should be compared against other magic items. The only magic item that makes it seem overpowered is the one that emulates Mage Armor. But there is not such an item base, and thus as per the rules for making magic items if an existing item exists you refer to its price. Thus you cannot use the item that emulates mage armor for comparison since it doesn't pass the rules for making magic items. Compared to every other magic source that increases AC bracers are as cheap as it gets.

I also Compared the Bracers to several different Armors in this very Thread!!

I feel that Mage Armor is not Overpowered. It is a Low Level Long Duration spell and a perfect fit for being placed into an Item.

Armor proficiency is an ability of each class. Thus the mundane AC bonus are a part of the class similar to a monks dodge bonus or wisdom bonus. Armor uses have the additional cost of the armor while monks/wizards/sorcerers have restrictions from using armor at all.

The Armor's I Listed earlier in this Thread have had 0 Armor Check Penalty. There is no penalty to using them without Proficiency!!!

Most of the Armor's I Listed had 0% Arcane Spell Failure as well!!

The only Class mentioned so far that suffers from the High Price of Bracers of Armor are Monks.

 

[ardentmoth]

An iron band, this simple ring generates a shield-sized (and shield-shaped) wall of force that stays with the ring and can be wielded by the wearer as if it were a heavy shield (+2 AC). This special creation has no armor check penalty or arcane spell failure chance since it is weightless and encumbrance-free. It can be activated and deactivated at will as a free action.

I believe the key operative word in that is CAN, as in it doesn't have to be, but it's possible.

 

[Slaved]

Certainly the Character could choose to not Wield the Shield but they should get no Benefit from it if they do not.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I believe the key operative word in that is CAN, as in it doesn't have to be, but it's possible.

Right, but note that the +2 AC is a feature of wielding it like a heavy shield.

If you don't wield it like a heavy shield, you don't get +2 AC.

-Hyp.

 

[billd91]

I did use the wrong Logical Fallacy to describe what was happening. That does not stop what was being done from being a Logical Fallacy however.

I believe that Appeal to Ridicule is a much better description.

Sorry, man. You're the one who made your own post subject to ridicule by presenting it in such a ridiculous fashion.

Your argument is addressed by my assessment that ghost touch's power to provide an armor bonus against incorporeal attacks is not at all the least of its significance.

 

[Shin Okada]

What makes you think that they are competitive? The only Class that might really want them is the Monk and that Class DOES NOT need yet another overpriced item to get a basic effect!!!!

As already mentioned, Mage Armor (or Greater version of it) is often dispelled, like any other buffing spells. And there are creatures who can't cast Mage Armor and has no proficiency on any armor.

Even for non-monster characters, higher level rangers and rogues may have +10 or higher Dex bonus and now Bracers of Armor is simply better than magic armors. Even Mithral Chain Shirt has max dex bonus to AC of 6. +4 armor bonus from chain shirt + max dex bonus of +6= +10. And now you can only apply +6 bonus to touch attacks while you can apply all of your dex bonus against touch attacks. And bracers or armor protects you against incorporeal creatures. And because that is a magic item and not spell effect, it is rarely dispelled.

 

[Hypersmurf]

And there are creatures who can't cast Mage Armor and has no proficiency on any armor.

That's a good point - if Slaved feels that most of the price for Ghost Touch is because of its utility for incorporeal monsters, then most of the price for Bracers of Armor should take into account their utility for Tyrannosauruses.

Whether or not they're all that great for anyone but the Monk, they're great for dinosaurs!

-Hyp.

 

[Mistwell]

Robe of Arcane Might (Magic Item Compendium, pg. 129)
+4 armor bonus to AC
+1 competence bonus to caster level for one school of magic
21,000gp
Requires Mage Armor to create

 

[VanRichten]

VanRichten - you need to look at the additional costs for multiple effects and also the item slot synergy table. Cloaks are considered defensive items, thus would not have the 50% bonus cost for being a non-synergistic slot. Further when you have multiple effects on one item, there is a 50% increase in cost of all effects except for the most expensive. Thus with a shield and mage armor effect, the mage armor is the cheaper of the two and would have the additional 50% tacked on. The MIC clarifies the rules for having multiple effects on one item. Since by base DMG it depends on the order inwhich you enchant it. Thus with the exception of upgrading an item as you go along it will always be on the cheaper (since as the craft you pick to do the most expensive one first). The MIC also changes it such that upgrading works the same way as base crafting (the 50% is never on the expensive component).

In answer to your statement we must remember that cloaks are inherently made for Resistance effects not Armor hence the increase in cost on the Mage Armor.

I also considered the Shield effect to be the greater of two effects since it inherently a greater effect due ot it being a shield effect for which a wizard is not normally allowed to use a shield. But if you feel that 50% is better then go for it. Still I feel the price as stated was correct since item in question in most DM's eyes would never be allowed anyway.

 

[Folly]

In answer to your statement we must remember that cloaks are inherently made for Resistance effects not Armor hence the increase in cost on the Mage Armor.

I also considered the Shield effect to be the greater of two effects since it inherently a greater effect due ot it being a shield effect for which a wizard is not normally allowed to use a shield. But if you feel that 50% is better then go for it. Still I feel the price as stated was correct since item in question in most DM's eyes would never be allowed anyway.

The DMG does not say anything about precedence in the creating magic items, and since the cloak is described as having an affinity for protection, any effect that provides defensive bonuses would not trigger the extra cost on cloaks.

The reason the extra 50% cost from having multiple effects goes onto the Mage Armor effect instead of the Shield effect is that the extra cost is placed on the second effect placed on the item(MIC changes this). So if you were creating this item in one crafting session you craft the more expensive effect first, so that it does not get hit by the extra cost.

Honestly I found both of these spells to be ill suited for becoming continuous effect items since there already exists items that provide similar continuous effect. If the item had limited charges, then it would be different from the continuous items and would not be caught by the first rule of pricing make items. For example, a Cloak of Mage Armor and Shield that has a command word activation(standard) and 5 charges of each a day would cost 6300. I do not think this price is too unreasonable, but I as a DM would do some tweaking to the item to add some minor restrictions.