Comparing Pathfinder and 4th Edition for 5Next

[ggroy]

OTOH Paizo fanboys are one of the most annoying things in the known universe, and have personally made me swear never to give Paizo a dime just to spite them.

So far I've only met one person who was a hardcore Pathfinder Golarion fanboy.

This person is almost just as annoying as a hardcore Forgotten Realms "canon lawyer".

 

[Dice4Hire]

This thread is going downhill fast.

All three systems, PF, 3.5 and 4E have benefits that I hope WOTC considers when they make %5E.

I especially agree about the modules and a coherent campaign world. Nentir Vale never did the coherent campaign world for me at all.

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

"According to ICV2 Wizards of the Coast is no longer the best selling RPG. Pathfinder is. ICV2 are a specialist firm of consultants who track the comic book, anime, games and collectible markets. Their sales charts have some authority"

Pathfinder outsells Dungeons and Dragons

And from the ICV2 article to which your linked article is referring: "This chart of the Top 5 Roleplaying Games (hobby channel) reflects sales in Q2 2011. The charts are based on interviews with retailers, distributors, and manufacturers." Numbers from a single quarter, and figures based on interviews... no mention of sample size of interviewees or how the interviewees got their numbers. Also no analysis of how many products were released in and around that quarter from the various publishers, which would certainly affect the numbers from a single quarter. So like [MENTION=55985]mkill[/MENTION] said, no convincing figures.

 

[Kynn]

I can't remember the last module produced by Wizards that made me say "Wow!". Almost all of the PF stuff I have played has done so. I've been running one group through Sins of the Seven Swords, and preparing to possibly embark on the Pharoah modules, while also playing in a campaign based in Korvosa, running through the Blood Veil (can't remember the name) adventure path.

Have you tried "Madness at Gardmore Abbey"?

 

[BryonD]

If you really want to know why Pathfinder is outselling 4th Edition, play both systems and compare them. I think the main reason is that the modules are designed really well. "Curse of the Everflame" is awesome. 4th edition needs such a module to teach its system.

I keep hearing this from 4E fans.

PF fans overwhelmingly disagree.

 

[BryonD]

Which isn't to say that Paizo doesn't make awesome adventures.

They do.

But system is the foundation of popularity.
If you have a great module, it is EASY to convert to a cool system.

 

[GreyICE]

So far I've only met one person who was a hardcore Pathfinder Golarion fanboy.

This person is almost just as annoying as a hardcore Forgotten Realms "canon lawyer".

You just reminded me why I was so happy when they trashed all the Realms canon. Thank you~

 

[Darkthorne]

I play both 4E (not essentials) & Pathfinder. To ME 4E = COMBAT focused, Pathfindor = combat or non-combat possibility. If I wanted someone in my ROLE playing game that focused 80% on non comat related abilities I can do that much more readily in Pathfinder and hard pressed in 4E. I have something to do outside of combat which I think most people enjoy, otherwise it just seems like your playing a boardgame, not an rpg. For me to "support" another in 4E it has to be in a combat function. Neither of my groups purchase adventure modules, yet there is more involvement & excitement for Pathfinder.

 

[mkill]

But system is the foundation of popularity.
If you have a great module, it is EASY to convert to a cool system.

Yeah, but the sale goes to the publisher who made the module, not the one who made the system you convert it to...

Of course, WotC did this to themselves. Paizo would probably be happy to make 4E/PF dual-system modules. WotC doesn't let them. *facepalm*

...

As for whether Pathfinder is a good system... I think there are five camps.
1) "True" Pathfinder fans - in for the PF improvements
2) Agnostic PF fans - play it for the continued 3E support
3) 4E fans - happy too get off 3E, find PF too 3E-like
4) Charoppers - Wanted a better balanced 3.5 and hate PF because it didn't deliver, and even made some things worse (warning - PF hater thread)
5) anyone not in 1-4

Camps 1) to 4) have not been able to agree on anything in the last 2-3 years. I don't think we'll come to any solution in this thread here either.

 

[Hussar]

I'm not sure which camp I fall into mkill. My issue with Pathfinder is the exact same issue I had with 3e - too damn much work for the DM. I had long given up creating virtually anything for 3e. I started running the World's Largest Dungeon in 05 (I think) and never created another 3e adventure from scratch thereafter.

4e solves that problem for me. I can bang out adventures in a fraction of the time and still get an experience that I enjoy. So, it's not so much the nitty gritty stuff that I tend to rant about here on En World that caused me to go over to 4e. It's pretty much solely that 3e was too much work for me.