Converting First Edition monsters from DRAGON magazine

[thom99]

Hey guys! just checkin in

In keeping with the "Issue 101" theme, could we do the orpsu after the avari is finished? I know that seems like a lot to ask

I shocked some of my old-timers with a surprise vampiric mist and a whipsting all in 1 night!! So I ran across this thread and saw the orpsu on it - they're another one of my favorite "weird critters"!

Sorry for the interuption Shade!

thomas

 

[BOZ]

Because I hate having to look up a spell to find out what a monster's ability does.

Seriously, though, I've noticed more and more newer creatures reprinting the relative text when an ability mimics part of a spell.

I kinda like the temporary paralysis option.

OK, I’ll keep it the way you wrote it then. how long should paralysis last – 2d4 rounds good enough?

True. It's been awhile since I wrote that, but I believe I took it from the CC mobat. I like "supersonic" in this instance. By default, they shouldn't be able to bite and screech in the same round, as both would be standard actions, right?

I don’t know – is that the case?

Is it that way? I was just going by summon monster and summon nature's ally.

no, it isn’t that way, and you’re right. summon it is!

Good catch on the telepathic command.

think that should mimic a druid/ranger type ability, or be a totally different Su ability?

Agreed. I could see dumping the Spot bonus, though, as bats don't usually have very keen eyesight.

true, so I’d say no Spot bonus, but “They see into the ultraviolet and infrared spectrums” so we’d need something to replace the old infravision and ultravision with, so they are indeed not blind (or… are they?)

Silver alone. The varrangoins have dr/cold iron, so I figured we could be similar, but not too similar, to the other fiendish bat-folk.

LOL, ok suit yourself but I think I like “magic or silver” better.

So I think you are trying to tell me to add some bats to the organization line, right?

How about adding "and 5-8 dire bats and/or 11-20 bat swarms"?

not-so-subtle hint?

Should we figure out a summon monster spell appropriate for them, or mention that they are often brought to the Material Plane via planar ally spells?

another not-so-subtle hint? I don’t know, what’s the difference between the spell sets?


And thom, for orpsu, definitely a possibility… IIRC was also reused a few times in FR products later.

 

[Shade]

OK, I’ll keep it the way you wrote it then. how long should paralysis last – 2d4 rounds good enough?

Yeah, I think that should be enough.

I don’t know – is that the case?

Yep. From the Monster Types & Abilities File: "Using a supernatural ability is a standard action unless noted otherwise."

no, it isn’t that way, and you’re right. summon it is!

think that should mimic a druid/ranger type ability, or be a totally different Su ability?

How about we borrow this from lycanthropes...

Bat Empathy (Ex): Avari can communicate and empathize with normal or dire bats. This gives them a +4 racial bonus on checks when influencing the animal’s attitude and allows the communication of simple concepts and (if the animal is friendly) commands, such as "friend," "foe," "flee," and "attack."

We could also add "and other batlike creatures" to the end of the first sentence.

true, so I’d say no Spot bonus, but “They see into the ultraviolet and infrared spectrums” so we’d need something to replace the old infravision and ultravision with, so they are indeed not blind (or… are they?)

Well, since infravision was transformed into low-light vision and darkvision, we should probably stick with the outsider standard of darkvision.

And probably modify this...

Blindsense (Ex): A dire bat uses echolocation to pinpoint creatures within 40 feet. Opponents still have total concealment against the bat unless it can actually see them.

LOL, ok suit yourself but I think I like “magic or silver” better.

I'll take "magic and silver", but "magic or silver" is too easy for a 9-HD outsider. (I checked comparable critters, and most have /good or /cold iron or /silver).

not-so-subtle hint?

Indeed.

another not-so-subtle hint? I don’t know, what’s the difference between the spell sets?

Summon - fights for caster for 1 round/level.
Planar ally spells - makes a deal with outsider to perform some task.

And thom, for orpsu, definitely a possibility… IIRC was also reused a few times in FR products later.

Fine with me. I like all the monsters from the ol' Creature Catalogs.

 

[BOZ]

Summon - fights for caster for 1 round/level.
Planar ally spells - makes a deal with outsider to perform some task.

My question though, was can you take more than one standard action in the same round.

How about we borrow this from lycanthropes...

Bat Empathy (Ex): Avari can communicate and empathize with normal or dire bats. This gives them a +4 racial bonus on checks when influencing the animal’s attitude and allows the communication of simple concepts and (if the animal is friendly) commands, such as "friend," "foe," "flee," and "attack."

We could also add "and other batlike creatures" to the end of the first sentence.

purrrrfect.

Summon - fights for caster for 1 round/level.
Planar ally spells - makes a deal with outsider to perform some task.

hmm, tough choice, but I guess I would go with the latter – just to be evil.

 

[Shade]

My question though, was can you take more than one standard action in the same round.

Gotcha. And the answer is...no.

"In a normal round, you can perform a standard action and a move action, or you can perform a full-round action. You can also perform one or more free actions. You can always take a move action in place of a standard action."

hmm, tough choice, but I guess I would go with the latter – just to be evil.

I like your style.

 

[BOZ]

I guess that takes care of that then.

So how would we implement the planar ally thing?

also, posting in homebrews for a looksee (once we finish the mortai and avari we have 10 for posting - right in time to get some new ones up before gencon! )

 

[Shade]

How about..."Evil clerics often call an avari to the material plane using a planar ally spell, usually offering gold in exchange for the avari's services as a guardian or torturer."

The description is a bit light. Can we add some of this back in?

Avari are batlike humanoids native to the Middle Lower Planes, where they are the unfortunate rivals of daemonkind for territory. There they dwell in dank caverns filled with bats, and are usually encountered in similar surroundings on the Prime Material Plane.

Avari love the taste of human flesh.

Avari long ago dwelt in a central community, but their wars against daemonkind shattered their unity and forced them to exist as isolated clans in the most desolate reaches of their planes. They do not deserve pity, for the avari are among the cruelest races of the Lower Planes, and love torture for its own sake.

In the few places where avari flourish, they have set up a feudal system using slaves to satisfy their whims; as they often feed upon these serfs, the efficiency of this system is questionable. They have been known to negotiate with humans, particularly for gold (which avari crave), and will manipulate adventurers into attacking their enemies. They will usually try to eat anyone who appears incapable of resistance.

Since a dire bat is equal to summon nature's ally II, and the mobats aren't much better, I'd say that their summon monbat ability is the equivalent of a 3rd-level spell (since they get 1d4).

Blindsense 60 ft.?

Racial skill bonuses of +4?

CR 8? (They aren't quite as good as a vrock at 9).

Level Adjustment +9:
+1 for unbalanced ability scores
+2 for natural armor of that amount
+1 for flight
+1 for poison
+1 for spell resistance
+3 for resistances and immunities

 

[BOZ]

I hadn’t written most of the flavor text yet. of course, I think I meant to do so over the weekend…

Anyway, here you go:

The avari are a race of humanoid creatures that live in the Lower Planes, and are the chief rivals of yugoloths for territory. Unfortunately, they are neither as powerful or as numerous as the fiends and have lost much over time. Long ago, avari dwelt in a large central community, but their many wars shattered their unity, forcing them to live in isolated clan in desolate areas of the planes. They dwell there in dank caverns filled with bats, and inhabit similar environs when found on the Material plane.

The avari are renowned for their cruelty, and have a great love of torture and causing pain. They crave gold, and love the taste of human flesh, and will negotiate with humans to gain either. Evil clerics often call an avari to the Material plane using a planar ally spell, usually offering gold in exchange for the avari's services as a guardian or torturer.

In the few places where avari have been able to thrive they have established a feudal system, using slaves and serfs to satisfied their every whim. It is surprising how such a system can be maintained when the avari dine on their servants so frequently.

COMBAT
Avari will normally begin combat by screeching, then move in to attack. They will target humans first, hoping to save them for later meals.

 

[Shade]

Looks great!

 

[BOZ]

Ok, updating.