D&D General Critical Role Ending

[The-Magic-Sword]

Yeah i don't have a problem with their rules mastery at all, they def don't need to do it any better than they currently do, I was bringing it up in the sense that it isn't like they love the ruleset.

I would say Sam, Marisha, Ashley, and Taliesin all have had major issues in what I watched of Campaign 2. Sam and Ashley's stuff has been pretty well identified, but Marisha very frequently seems to improvise weird actions that don't actually go to any mechanics (and I really wish Matt didn't make those as punishing as he seems to in his rulings on them, but I also wish she would do it while framing her mechanical move as well), and while Cadecus was better, Mollymauk was painful to watch played spamming that cantrip every turn with bad stats.

They're all great people and I love the show, but I can't imagine they care too much for the ruleset. I'd love to see PF2e, but thats just me, honestly if I were thinking of what would actually be a good fit for them?

It would have to be either a relatively light Story Now game with an emphasis on character drama and improvisation, or an OSR for a dnd-like experience that doesn't boil down to rolling attacks in combat as much and ups the time spent on shenanigans

 

[Parmandur]

Huh, I didn't know Mercer doesn't like DMing high-level games (not surprising, their a huge pain to design for). Can I see the source, just for curiosity?

Oh, Lord, I'm sorry, butnI can't 0oint to the source: some fireside chat or convention appearance where he went into it. It's not like am absolute preference, but he likes the sweet spot of mid-level play.

 

[Parmandur]

I can understand some first year jitters.

But by now they are literally professional actors/players...

Granted nobody's perfect, and in the heat of the moment there will still be mistakes made.

But at a minimum they should be well versed on how combat works, and what their own characters can do, including spells.

Not everything needs to be memorized, but at a minimum they should have handy rules references close at hand that they can look at while waiting their turn.

They do understand the rules, though they are not power gamers. Mercer is usually able to scare them with encounters well below their ability to handle, through clever stagecraft.

 

[Iry]

They play for the story, not the mechanics. It’s honestly a lot more fun and interesting that way, both to watch and play. It’s one of the many reasons they’re the top live play stream in the world.

They could be doing both! I mean, they are obviously having a lot of fun and it's working for them. So, as a business decision, I wouldn't touch the amazing alchemy they have going on. But if it was still a home game, I would have had a few gentle talks with them OOC about respecting fellow players and their time.

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

Absolutely, and why WotC‘s endless noodling around Faerûn is so uninspiring. There’s a whole world to explore (apparently) and they’re content with the Sword Coast and environs. (Random M:tG and Ravenloft one-offs notwithstanding )

When I came into D&D over 4.5 years ago and people were telling me about the Forgotten Realms, this was a major issue with me about it. I like a lot of small parts of the Forgotten Realms, like Icewind Dale, Waterdeep, the Netheril, most of Realmspace, and other minutia, but the setting was always explained to me as a "gigantic world with endless possibilities and tons of content", but there never seemed to be much content for any non-Sword Coast places, especially lacking content for non-Faerun places. Fantasy Australia (Osse) has practically no official descriptions. Maztica has a tiny bit of lore, but not much at all. I could go on and on. The place of endless possibilities seemed to end after you leave the borders of the European-themed portion of the world.

Exandria is far better in that factor, IMO. Matt isn't scared to go to other places in the world and give the detailed, intricate and inspiring bits of lore. The Kryn Dynasty is awesome, as is Aeor, Blightshore, Uk'otoa, and a ton of the other content added to the Critical Role universe through Wildemount. Exploring new places and creating new lore can positively benefit a campaign setting a ton.

 

[BRayne]

They could be doing both! I mean, they are obviously having a lot of fun and it's working for them. So, as a business decision, I wouldn't touch the amazing alchemy they have going on. But if it was still a home game, I would have had a few gentle talks with them OOC about respecting fellow players and their time.

They are generally considered one of the more rule-heavy Actual Plays actually

 

[Parmandur]

They are generally considered one of the more rule-heavy Actual Plays actually

Crunchy games just don't fit streaming. Part of m the perfect storm of 5E's back to basics approach, good timing in pop culture.

 

[Jaeger]

Based off watching them actually play it, I don't think they really like the system much at all-- half the group has been playing it for quite a few years now and still aggressively has no idea what they're doing mechanically.

So, with that out of the way. I honestly think most of them perform at a lower mechanical level than they should be at this point (certainly lower than my own players).

3.) The lack of rule knowledge by the players is a factor of who those players are, not disdain for the game. If you play long enough, you'll play with a lot of people that ask every week which die to roll for initiative. It doesn't mean they're not having fun or hate the rule set ... some people are just that way.

While it is true that out in the wider world there are people who just refuse to learn basic stuff, you'd think that the CR players would put a bit more effort on the system side of things so that they match the professionalism of the rest of the production.

They do seem to be otherwise perfectly intelligent people, and for professional actors/players the continual lack of basic understanding is inexplicable at this point.

They do understand the rules, though they are not power gamers. ...

Not talking about power gaming.

Just knowing basic stuff that the GM should not have to remind you of after years of play...

Again, these are paid professionals.

IMHO, part of the problem from what I can see is that they have no quick rules references, or spell sheets they can quickly look at.

Tablets w/apps are just not a quick as having a sheet right there out in front for you to see. They are a false convenience.

And it's not like they are lacking for tablespace.

They play for the story, not the mechanics. It’s honestly a lot more fun and interesting that way, both to watch and play. It’s one of the many reasons they’re the top live play stream in the world.

In my opinion; CR would be better served with a system more like Dungeon World, or maybe a custom OSR game that is in between the complexity of 5e and DW.

But then they would not be able to say that they are playing D&D "The worlds most popular RPG"...

They could do it though, WOTC needs them more than they need WOTC, they aren't successful because of 5e's fanbase, whereas 5e owes a lot of its success to them.

Not really. The CR exposure certainly hasn't hurt, far from it. But D&D was riding a wider pop-culture upswing regardless.

No one likes to admit this, but it’s so true. 5E is as much of a blockbuster as it is because of CR. Not the other way round.

No. CR rode the D&D popularity wave just as hard as WOTC did.

I've been directed by some googling to episode 4 of the original campaign where he has a Q&A in which he says what you say, but also that D&D has better name recognition, which is "important when you are doing a show". I may have got the order of priority wrong, but the popularity of the game was totally a factor. These days, now that many more viewers are accustomed to watching people play tabletop games as a means of entertainment, picking games people are less familiar with is doubtlessly more viable, but back in 2015 the show needed all the help it could get.

Yup and D&D got a ton of free advertising the past several years too:

Regular mentions/appearances in:
The Big Bang Theory
Stranger Things
Episodes in:
Community
Freaks and Geeks
The IT Crowd

And that's just the short list. Each of those shows having much further reach than CR.

5e just had perfect timing that no one could predict. It was the right edition at the right time.

 

[Parmandur]

While it is true that out in the wider world there are people who just refuse to learn basic stuff, you'd think that the CR players would put a bit more effort on the system side of things so that they match the professionalism of the rest of the production.

They do seem to be otherwise perfectly intelligent people, and for professional actors/players the continual lack of basic understanding is inexplicable at this point.




Not talking about power gaming.

Just knowing basic stuff that the GM should not have to remind you of after years of play...

Again, these are paid professionals.

IMHO, part of the problem from what I can see is that they have no quick rules references, or spell sheets they can quickly look at.

Tablets w/apps are just not a quick as having a sheet right there out in front for you to see. They are a false convenience.

And it's not like they are lacking for tablespace.




In my opinion; CR would be better served with a system more like Dungeon World, or maybe a custom OSR game that is in between the complexity of 5e and DW.

But then they would not be able to say that they are playing D&D "The worlds most popular RPG"...




Not really. The CR exposure certainly hasn't hurt, far from it. But D&D was riding a wider pop-culture upswing regardless.


No. CR rode the D&D popularity wave just as hard as WOTC did.


Yup and D&D got a ton of free advertising the past several years too:

Regular mentions/appearances in:
The Big Bang Theory
Stranger Things
Episodes in:
Community
Freaks and Geeks
The IT Crowd

And that's just the short list. Each of those shows having much further reach than CR.

5e just had perfect timing that no one could predict. It was the right edition at the right time.

Most of them have zero time for prep. Sam Riegal has an insane workload, particularly. They do alright, and frankly I think their lack of rules expertise is part of the charm for a lot of people: it makes for a very authentic gaming experience.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Printing chocolate 3d minis shouldn't be too hard to extrapolate from current tech.

I think there's a 50/50 chance that the next campaign will be set somewhere else than Exandria. Or at least on a yet-unknown continent. Matt Mercer loves to explore his worlds with his players.

Marqet is pretty unexplored by any PCs, so far. We have seen basically two locations.

Still, yeah, maybe he will surprise us all and start things in a different world. What I’d love to see is a game that is set on the moon, but you don’t realize that until at least a few episodes in.