cross role multiclassing

[hipnotode]

i am wondering if multiclassing across two rolls would you loose more than you would gain, for example a defender|leader (to become more self reliant) or a defender|controller (to keep those pesky mobs from running away), would you loose too much from the defender to make you able to tank efficiently? or like a leader|controler (to be able to both buff and debuff) would you weaken both too much?
basically what im asking is is it worth it? ive been looking at multiclass builds alot recently (i like building consept characters, and have become bored with making high chance-to-hit rouges, and high min damage sorcerers etc lately) and am wondering how they will react in play (i should really find a group willign to let me just playtest builds with them... maybe help out with dungeon playtests or something.) has anyone played a cross-class multiclass before? how did that turn out?

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

It can work very well.

I have a Wizard multiclassed into Shaman for the once-per-encounter healing, and now in addition to being a full-blown Controller, she's half a Leader as well. I fluffed the Spirit Companion as a Spectral Hand.

I also have a Valourous Bard multiclassed as (among other things) a Paladin. He has had to be off-tank before, and I have found that it really helps fill the role, though he doesn't really have the defences or hit points to last long at it. It does suit his personality and inclinations however.

I haven't used this particular trick yet, but multiclassing Rogue for a once-per-encounter Sneak Attack can really add a nice bit of secondary striker to a character. Works particularly well for a Tempest Fighter using rapiers or shortswords.

I've see a lot of builds multiclass avenger for the reroll ability for two turns. This also works especially well with multi-hitters like Tempests.

I really haven't got much experience with power swap feats, as they seem like a really bad deal in most cases. Though there are some really nice ones (swapping for the Warlock level 10 at-will teleport utility, for example).

If you are actually referring to hybrid-classed characters, you have to really be careful. It's easy to nerf yourself with a few bad choices. Some combos are about as effective as a regular character, most are weaker, and a few are stronger.

There is a pretty good hybird build guide here.

 

[Ryujin]

I rather enjoyed playing a Feylock/Bard multi. It worked thematically. The healing was useful, for those times when I was cut off from the Cleric (because he got all hot & bothered about chasing down some random undead). Bard feat and ritual support expanded character interaction utility (high CHA + Skald's Armor + Glib Limerick for a double Bluff roll, for the win!). Some Bard Paragon Paths work quite well, with a character that's primarily a Warlock (Grave Caller comes immediately to mind).

 

[Herschel]

I'm in the boat of not being sure if you're talking about multi-classing or hybrid. Multiclassing is pretty nice as it opens feat and power choices and usually adds a skill. I have a 10th level Genasi Thaneborn Barbarian multi-classed as a Warlord with a helm of battle. The leader role is filled by a Shaman, not exactly mr. social. I really don't like any of the Barbarian paragon path choices. My character concept originally had me going towards Elemental Tempest for my paragon path but when reviewing the Warlord PPs there are a number of really good ones, especially Freedom Fighter. One feat and a whole plethora of options opened up that I didn't previously have. It also gave me another set of skill utilities to chose from.

 

[aurance]

Multiclassing across roles is usually fine, and sometimes even makes your primary role better.

Hybriding across roles is a bit trickier, and you generally want to do this only when the roles are filled by other people already, and you're a fifth member. Exceptions do exist however.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Check your action economy but yes, it can work superbly. Leaders hybrid superbly - you attack with the powers from your other class (often striker or controller) to get striker damage and get the healing for free. And if you can't find a leader to match your stat there's always the "Lazy Warlord" for complete stat independence. Some defenders hybrid better than others; the fighter's marking is wrapped up in fighter attacks, so he'd work best hybriding with a leader or the like. But the Swordmage can mark and run and use non-swordmage attacks, so hybrids very well with controllers where the power is in the attack powers.

Archery Ranger|Lazy Warlord should be banned; from the ranger you get Twin Strike (which is really all you need to make you a top tier striker) and then you get all the goodies of half a warlord for minimal loss. And there's not even a stat problem because a lazy warlord doesn't make his own attacks. Powerful Warning at 1 and Disruptive Strike at 3 on their own are enough to make your DM hate you.

Swordmage|Wizard are overpowered as well. The Swordmage marks and provides extra AC to the wizard - who promptly runs away and messes up the bad guys with wizard powers. See also Swordmage|Psion

Feylock|Chaladin. There's some serious synergy here. Paladin armour proficiency gets you in plate and a heavy shield. Eyebite and Divine Challenge work well together - your target is marked by you but can't see you. You do low striker damage with your warlock powers - and marking and AC with the Paladin making you a decent Defender. And then there's your Sanctions. Sanction everyone and run.

Tempest Fighter|Rogue. Tempest gives you even higher statics for your damage boost. And in a pinch or on an action point turn you can mark - although you need a few risks to get Combat Advantage. (Fighter Daily: Rain of Steel with statics that are through the roof).

Invoker|Shaman Hand of Radiance is all the at will you need and Invoker class features aren't all that unless you're Wrathful in a minion-heavy game. So clutter up the battlefield with a Spirit Companion (or rather a Guardian Angel) and gain some healing and some more really annoying control while you are at it.

As for multiclassing, go for it Just pick a multiclass feat that looks useful - the feats are almost all good and you don't need to go any further as there are enough good feats that power swapping isn't often worth it.

 

[Mengu]

Yeah, cross role multiclassing is fine. Depends on what you need/want, or what your party needs. My sorcerer grabbed bard multiclass, for a skill he wants, and the emergency heal to help out the party. My barbarian and paladin are also likely to pick up bard multiclass when there is an available feat. My Runepriest grabbed fighter multiclass with Battle Awareness for a skill, a bit of extra striking (go figure, defender MC for striking), and will also pick up Rain of Steel with power swap in a few levels. My Warlord picked up ranger multiclass more for perception and fluff reasons, but the extra damage doesn't hurt. Strange as it might be, my Invoker also has ranger multiclass.

Looking at a few more of my characters I don't think I have any that multiclass within their role.

For hybrids, most combinations I'm fond of are cross-role, with one role typically being striker, Fighter|Ranger, Cleric|Ranger, Paladin|Sorcerer, Battlemind|Warlock, Swordmage|Warlock, etc.

 

[interwyrm]

Feylock|Chaladin. There's some serious synergy here. Paladin armour proficiency gets you in plate and a heavy shield. Eyebite and Divine Challenge work well together - your target is marked by you but can't see you. You do low striker damage with your warlock powers - and marking and AC with the Paladin making you a decent Defender. And then there's your Sanctions. Sanction everyone and run.

Sanction everyone, then use decree of khirad to make them all attack each other... and take the sanction damage.

Warlock in general is a very good hybrid. Eldritch strike is a superb melee basic attack, and complements all defender classes very well - especially when using the CON based version.

 

[mudlock]

I played an eladrin fighter PMC wizard from 1 to 16, and took great advantage of the fighter's "mark everyone you attack" and the wizard's area effect and potent defensive utility powers. (Flameburst with enlarge spell and marks providing a -3, and either Shield (or Stoneskin) if you draw more heat than you can handle.) It was a little MAD, but you don't need to hit to provide a mark. Basically, I became a controller whose only power was "give all the bad-guys a -3 to hit".

Caveats: this was when 4e was new (I'd planned to go Wizard of the Spiral Tower, until arcane implement proficiency: heavy blade made that unnecessary), there are now str/int races (and the water genasi racial is probably as-good or better than fey step for this), monsters generally hit harder so marking *literally* everyone each round might be a worse idea now, and this was a six-man party with a second defender (who was focused exclusively to go mano-y-mano) as well as a primary controller... but on the other hand, defensive feats are more powerful now (for all those extra feat slots I have?) and Beguiling Strands(!)... damnit, now I want to play another Fighter/Wizard...

I had a great time with it, it was awesome, and I think cross-role (and cross-powersource) multiclassing is a lot more interesting than on-role.

 

[WOLead]

how did that turn out?

Sticking to the ones I've actually played, rather then just builds/potential?

Swordmage|Warlock: This one is technically a Defender|Striker hybrid, but both classes contain a hefty chunk of Controller that you may as well consider 1/3rd of each. These builds usually turn out very well for me, though I often just play them in the Con/Int format. Defense of a Defender, as well as its marking. Mobility with a small damage boost of a Striker. Finally a few AoE encounter/dailies along with forced movement and other possibly status effects for the control.
-5th Man. Considered a "secondary" in Defender, Striker, and Controller. Can literally act as all three at once.

Shaman|Psion: Leader|Controller. This combination simply rocked. I would focus on controller early, to delay/hassle/disrupt the enemy to keep my alives alive. Later, I would enable from the Shaman to provide a hefty punch of damage for focus fire. It could not act as the party's only healer, rather as an emergancy or backup one. Oh, and it found single use of almost any skill within his grasp once per encounter easily.
-Controller when useful/needed, Enabler(Leader) otherwise.

Battlemind|Invoker: Defender|Controller it...just didn't ever mesh together for me. I'll likely try a Swordmage|Psion for my next played Defender|Controller hybrid to see how it goes.
-Miss (For me at least)

Half-elf Warlord PMC Warlock: Leader MC Striker, my very first 4e character, starting from level 3 to level 14. The multi-class didn't add too much to the Warlord, except for a chunk of mobility I took advantage of quite well. Half-elf PMC(Warlock) on the other hand, changed a LOT. Defense boost from Shadow Walk, Divine Sanction from At-Will swap while keeping Eldritch Strike + Staggering Longsword by Dilettante gave a nice Defender feel to the Leader. The Encounter power from Novice Power and PMC let me get Controller aspects twice per encounter by either the Immobilized+Teleport 5 in a C.Burst 1 by Otherwind Stride or C.Blast 3 Daze UEoNT. Striker was "obtained" by simply enabling the heavy hitter in the party.
-Leader with a trick at first. Primary Leader/Secondary Defender with a dash of Control and a feel of Striker by proxy at the end.