D&D General D&D Combat is fictionless

[Lyxen]

So you claim, where as in other sentences you call recovering hit points -> removing wounds. Which I find convincing evidence otherwise.

Because, ultimately, when you fall, dying, at 0 hp, it's not for lack of divine favor, luck, resolve, whatever other components are in hit points. They have contributed to keeping you alive, and in some rare cases, the lack of them might be the cause of your death, but monsters, on the other side, are not draining your luck, your divine favor or your resolve, they are hitting you with weapons and spells that deal physical damage for the most part (yes, there might be cases of psychic damage, but again, brain damage and nosebleed is an equally acceptable answer, very visual, very cinematic and used in many cases, see Stranger Things for example).

So, when you come down to the narrative side, because it's the point of this thread, there is only so much you can do to convincingly describe the loss of luck and divine favour when orcs are hitting you with axes. I use it, of course, to justify the axe not disembowling you, but it's much more narrative, full of fiction and visual to have at least a part being physical, even though the buffer of divine favour/luck/resolve keeps you going with just a scratch.

Again, it's not that I don't integrate them in hit points and healing, it's just that when playing narratively it works much better in the long run, it's more consistent internally and with the fiction that we are trying to emulate.

Perhaps or perhaps that is playing against tropes that certainly happens I suppose when it does go that route perhaps the subject is not so much a heroic personage and in 4e perhaps they are out of healing surges and/or failing a death check.

There are always good reasons, and indeed the lack of hit points (from any source) is the first cause of having someone "dying" in the first place, but the reason before that is the axes wielded by the orcs, these don't hit your resolve but your flesh...

 

[Garthanos]

There are always good reasons, and indeed the lack of hit points (from any source) is the first cause of having someone "dying" in the first place, but the reason before that is the axes wielded by the orcs, these don't hit your resolve but your flesh...

But never ever ever badly enough to really impair unless you fail that last death save... 3 rounds after they hit because seems a bit of a ret con to me.

 

[Garthanos]

Because, ultimately, when you fall, dying, at 0 hp, it's not for lack of divine favor, luck, resolve, whatever other components are in hit points. They have contributed to keeping you alive, and in some rare cases, the lack of them might be the cause of your death, but monsters, on the other side, are not draining your luck, your divine favor or your resolve

Those resources fatigue when they are being tested and running out (not being drained) thus preventing the real injuries. The resources are even called hit points ... not wound points.

You also notice those axes hitting does not mean "hitting" in an earlier comment about the shield effect but not now.

Sigh

 

[Lyxen]

But never ever ever badly enough to really impair unless you fail that last death save... 3 rounds after they hit because seems a bit of a ret con to me.

If it's anything of the kind (which I don't think it is), it's at least consistent with the fiction of the genre, whereas just a simple "get up, you are not actually dying" is not (except, of course, in humorous fiction).

Those resources fatigue when they are being tested and running out (not being drained) thus preventing the real injuries. The resources are even called hit points ... not wound points.

Now, you are the one going away from the rules: "Hit points (hp) measure your ability to stand up to punishment, turn deadly strikes into glancing blows, and stay on your feet throughout a battle. Hit points represent more than physical endurance."

So Hit Points still represent physical endurance at least partially. It's "more" but not "not physical endurance". So the wound part is in there for sure. Whether it's the majority or not depends on the character mostly.

 

[Garthanos]

So Hit Points still represent physical endurance at least partially.

What do you think the words resistant to fatigue means? "physical endurance or psychic endurance"

They do not necessarily mean resisting wounds at all...

Even fatigue irl causes impairment and you are resisting that with adrenaline etc

 

[Lyxen]

What do you think the word resistant to fatigue means? "physical endurance or psychic endurance"

You are again ignoring half of it "ability to stand up to punishment." In every edition, there has been a core of physical resistance to wounds, complemented by various way to avoid or lessen them. But at the core, when you are dying, it's because of wounds, not lack of resolve.

 

[Fenris-77]

What do you think the word resistant to fatigue means? "physical endurance or psychic endurance"

Generally, or in terms of this thread specifically? In the latter case I'd go with psychic endurance for sure.

 

[Garthanos]

You are again ignoring half of it "ability to stand up to punishment."

punishment that never ever impairs even just a small low constitution wizard
that to me is big flag... tell me all the axe wounds with that kind of effect

But at the core, when you are dying, it's because of wounds, not lack of resolve.

AD&D points it out well to me when you get all your hit points back if you fell below zero you are still fully disabled in spite of your hit points. Hit points gained were absolutely not necessarily removing wounds

Hitpoints lost are what you spend evading wounds not a measure of wounds except incidentally.

 

[MichaelSomething]

The HP system has always pulled towards being easier to use in play/make the game functional over simulating wounds/being realistic.

How much friction will you accept for fiction? That's for you to decide...

 

[Garthanos]

To be honest I think temporary hit points are an unnecessary complication. Because all hit points are really temporary. The distinction feels artificial.