Damage reduction question

[hong]

That is not true though. The secondary effects stopped are the ones you mentioned. Extra energy damage is not a secondary effect of a weapon with energy enhancements, it is bonus damage (that is not subject to DR).

Hm. I'm not sure that's a big enough distinction to matter. "Bonus" and "secondary" aren't terms of art in the 3E rules, at least not in this context. Treating them as synonyms would still be consistent with the rules.

Actually, I kinda like the idea of DR stopping flaming, frost, shock etc from functioning. It would help cut down on the stacking of multiple energy enchantments, although GMW complicates things.

 

[James McMurray]

But if it can stop a flaming sword's fire damage, why can't it stop a torch's fire damage? Or a fireball's?

Plus, not having it stop energy effects from weapons lets characters fighting creatures with DR beyond their weapon's range get a few shots in anyway.

 

[hong]

But if it can stop a flaming sword's fire damage, why can't it stop a torch's fire damage? Or a fireball's?

Because the primary damage form of these attacks is the energy damage. You don't get "bonus"/"secondary"/whatever fire damage from a fireball, you just get fire damage.

Plus, not having it stop energy effects from weapons lets characters fighting creatures with DR beyond their weapon's range get a few shots in anyway.

Well, that then becomes an adventure design issue, to do with how often you involve your characters in such combats.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

The DMG says that DR does not negate energy damage dealt along with an attack and uses a fire elemental's attack as an example, which is very much like a flaming sword. A Medium-Size fire elemental does a slam attack for 1d6+1 damage and also 1d6 in fire damage. DR may totally negate the slam damage, but not the fire damage. Likewise, a +1 flaming longsword may do no normal damage against a creature with a DR of 20/+2, but the 1d6 fire damage will still affect it normally because its DR will not negate it.

 

[Shadeus]

Hmm, duh. For some reason I never just checked the DMG. It states pretty clearly on p. 73-74 what DR affects. Interesting that "special effects" are resisted (poison, disease, or monk's stunning blow), but "touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains" have a full effect.

Of course the bullet point below that one states specifically that "magical attacks and energy attacks (even mundane fire) ignore damage reduction."

 

[FANGO]

This is being done without books, but I do believe that if DR completely stops the damage from a weapon it also stops the associated effects of being hit with that weapon from happening. Examples are poison from a poisoned weapon or ability of a creature, and I suppose that a flaming weapon would also be counted under that. Also, my reading of the dwarven defender's DR was that it was different than the rest...not only is it denoted differently ("Damage Reduction (6)" instead of "DR 6/-"), but in the description of the ability I seem to remember it saying that it stopped all damage done to the defender, whereas DR descriptions usually either don't specifically mention what the DR does or mention the energy damage stipulation.


edit...I suppose that shadeus answered my first part in the post just above, so I guess I withdraw that comment but the other one still stands....

 

[Macbrea]

The full rules to damage resistance on in the DMG. That being said any write up in a class should also refer to the page in the DMG.

Dwarven defender should be 3/- and 6/-. They suffered from lazy editting. And were designed before wizards got a format down.

You will notice that only injury poisons suffer the effects of DR. Contact poisons still go straight throught the skin.

Now, the question I have is if Level and Stat drain are stopped by DR if they don't penetrate the DR, Does this mean someone with 1/- is immune to an Allip?

 

[SableWyvern]

DMG p74

Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack (such as fire damage from a fire elemental), or energy drains.

I would rule that any stat loss, apart from that resulting from injury type poison, should have been included in that quote, although technically it is not.

Even so, most (possibly all) undead stat drains are covered by the touch attack proviso.

Hence, an Allip is not affected by any DR.

 

[kreynolds]

I would rule that any stat loss, apart from that resulting from injury type poison, should have been included in that quote, although technically it is not.

Stat loss, aside from poison, is a form of energy drain. Energy Drain will either drain an ability score or drain you of levels. It's not subject to DR, even according to the rules, so you don't have to house rule it. You were doing it right.

 

[SableWyvern]

Hey Kreynolds: unless I've missed something, according to the DMG:

Energy Drain = level loss.
Temporary Ability Damage = exactly what it says.
Ability Drain = permanent ability loss.

Ability drain and energy drain are two completely different things.