Dave Noonan Responds about Wizard Implements

[Varianor Abroad]

Why do I feel like a focus group member getting rushed out of the room to the next one before I'm done filling in all the little circles? This "test the waters" posting is different. I'm not sure it's better.

Mechanically, having an equivalent to a fighter's set of weapons makes sense in the abstract. At the table though, I think a lot of people are used to being able to use all spells all the time. You don't see fighters whipping out a lot of different weapons. They usually have a hand-to-hand and an occasional ranged one (reverse this for your archer players). If the magic system winds up the same way, cool.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

I've seen you post this before... is there some utility in having a list of people who use this particular word?

You're taking a running joke far too seriously.

Also, have you never heard of folks jokingly saying "Blah, blah is now on my sh*t list"?

 

[Patlin]

You're taking a running joke far too seriously.

Also, have you never heard of folks jokingly saying "Blah, blah is now on my sh*t list"?

Wasn't actually taking it seriously, probably should have included a smiley.

There are two or three other sorts of less friendly lists I can think of off the top of my head, though, and it seems like a pretty harmless word, even if it's from a fictional language. It's a lot shorter than saying warrior/mage all the time.

 

[Andor]

That's it. You're now on my gish list.

 

[reanjr]

In my mind, the deity/domain system was one of the best innovations of 3E. That is a really elegant way of injecting flavor into a class.

I thought it was terrible for flavor. Every cleric is basically the same mechanically. Spheres were much better.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

Good point - and this makes me think about that design diary about fighters choosing different weapons so that they could learn special tricks associated with those weapons - remember the armour piercing spear, the flurrying longsword and the crushing hammer or whatever they were?

Perhaps the same system (whatever it is) that underlies that fighter configuration could also underlie the wizards implements too?

Cheers

Well, if traditions are not groupings of spells, or spell effects, here's my guess as to what they're doing.

The article talks about using implements to channel spells, while the traditions are associated with spell effects. So I expect that, as Noonan says, the implements are like weapons. They provide a bonus "to hit" with spells (whatever that might happen to mean), and allow specific tricks to be added. The wizard in the playtest using her wizard strike was adding a staff trick--moving an enemy--to the effect. If she had an orb readied, perhaps she could do the same wizard strike, but root the enemy in place (the article mentioned an "ensnaring" effect associated with orbs) instead of moving it. The implements, then, are tools by which you apply templates to your spells.

The traditions look like they simply provide you with bonuses to use certain effects. Using the weapon analogy, if implements cover "to hit," then traditions cover "damage". If you're a Serpent Eye wizard, you have access to feats, skill trees, or whatever that will allow you to add templates, bonuses, or special effects to your enchantment spells to make them more effective. If you're an Iron Sigil wizard, you can do the same sort of thing to abjurations. If implements let you add effects to spells (and make spells more likely to work), traditions let you ramp up existing effects.

That's the way I'm reading them, anyway.

 

[Jhaelen]

That's it. You're now on my gish list.

Ha! You're now on my gish-listers list!

 

[Driddle]

(moved to other thread)

 

[fuindordm]

I thought it was terrible for flavor. Every cleric is basically the same mechanically. Spheres were much better.

Spheres were cool for flavor, but too hard to balance in my mind. You kept ending up with jillions of low-level spells and a bare handful of high-level spells. I think domains strike a nice balance between balance and flavor, although if it were me I would have cut down the general spell list substantially and not been afraid to give the domains sometimes two spells per level.

Cheers!

 

[fuindordm]

Well, if traditions are not groupings of spells, or spell effects, here's my guess as to what they're doing.

I expect that, as Noonan says, the implements are like weapons. They provide a bonus "to hit" with spells (whatever that might happen to mean), and allow specific tricks to be added. The wizard in the playtest using her wizard strike was adding a staff trick--moving an enemy--to the effect. If she had an orb readied, perhaps she could do the same wizard strike, but root the enemy in place (the article mentioned an "ensnaring" effect associated with orbs) instead of moving it. The implements, then, are tools by which you apply templates to your spells.

That would be pretty darn cool, actually.