Define "___-edition feel"?

[Gundark]

hmmmm....the summon Diaglo spell must have been cast with the delay spell metamagic feat....thought he'd jumped on this one by now

 

[rounser]

3E/3.5E: Campaign. ...the focus seems to be on building campaigns...Computer analogy: Baldur's Gate series.

All IMO, but you have got to be kidding...3E's official adventure offerings have absolutely nothing, nothing on the Baldur's Gate series, which IMO kick the dull dungeon marathons of the Adventure Path, RttToEE etc. to the curb.

3E/3.5E: Campaign. This is the easiest to pigeonhole, as the new edition hasn't been out very long, but WotC has already stopped producing modules, and the focus seems to be on uninspired dungeon crawls and churning out crunch. While story and plot are important, they're not necessarily more important than crunch and dungeons, as they were in 2E. Computer analogy: Dungeon Hack.

Fixed it for you.

 

[rounser]

I have also never seen an ogrillon outside of a 1E product.

Agreed...Fiend Folio's redundant humanoid races scream 1E to me. If anything, orcs, orcs and more orcs is kind of dull compared to a merry smorgasbord of gibberlings, xvarts, ogrillons, meenlocks, flinds etc.

Then again, not everyone's idea of a 1E campaign was flail snail friendly...

Ogrillons did appear with a relatively largish presence in 2E's Greyhawk Ruins, from memory, so it may be a reference to that.

 

[Dark Jezter]

I knew this would turn into an "Edition Wars" thread sooner or later, with all the usual arguments like "3e is more rollplaying than roleplaying!" and "3e modules are nothing but mindless dungeon crawls!"

 

[rounser]

I knew this would turn into an "Edition Wars" thread sooner or later, with all the usual arguments like "3e is more rollplaying than roleplaying!" and "3e modules are nothing but mindless dungeon crawls!"

You assume too much. Where did I say any edition had anything on the Baldur's Gate series, or Planescape: Torment for that matter? As far as 3E's official module series being much more than dungeon crawls, and uninspired/dull ones at that IMO, it's guilty as charged IMO. This opinion has naught to do with 2E and 1E (which had and have problems of their own, and their own fair share of poor quality dungeon crawls, but not just that..e.g. Dark Sun's "Freedom" series of modules were a high water mark for D&D, any edition, IMO).

 

[Urbannen]

hmmmm....the summon Diaglo spell must have been cast with the delay spell metamagic feat....thought he'd jumped on this one by now

No, Diaglo likes the Original, or Classic D&D from 1974. Mirrorball Man was talking about Basic, or OD&D, which had the Basic, Expert, Master, Companion, Immortal, and Rules Cyclopedia sets. It was first released around 1978 (I think). Check out Bregh's post above.

Just today I was trying to explain to my friend the difference between the D&Ds, and I still don't think he got it. I agree with Mirrorball Man - OD&D is a very nice system. It has an archetypal, 4-color fantasy feel that I like, with more elegant mechanics than AD&D. I was playing OD&D right before 3.0 came out.

 

[Sir Whiskers]

All IMO, but you have got to be kidding...3E's official adventure offerings have absolutely nothing, nothing on the Baldur's Gate series, which IMO kick the dull dungeon marathons of the Adventure Path, RttToEE etc. to the curb.

I think we're talking about two slightly different things. You seem to be referring to WOTC's (and other publishers'?) products. I'm referring to how the game has been played (at least in the groups I've been around) since 3E came out. I'm also basing my comment on how often "campaign" comes up on these boards. YMMV.

BTW, I always used OD&D to mean the white box set - I didn't realize some use the same term for the D&D sets released later (red, etc). No wonder these discussions seem to always become confusing...

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

BTW, I always used OD&D to mean the white box set - I didn't realize some use the same term for the D&D sets released later (red, etc).

"D&D" is now the official name of the third edition. If "OD&D" is the name we use to refer to the antiquated white box set, how do you call the Basic/Expert/Companion/Master/Immortal D&D? BECMI D&D? Boxed D&D? Old fashioned D&D? Ur-D&D?

 

[Bregh]

It's fashionable on OOP boards like Dragonsfoot to call the Moldvay-Cook/Mentzer boxed sets BECM D&D to distinguish it from Classic/white box OD&D, or to refer to these older versions of D&D by the names of their editors: Holmes, Moldvay/Cook, Mentzer, RC (Rules 'Cyclopaedia).

 

[rounser]

I'm referring to how the game has been played (at least in the groups I've been around) since 3E came out. I'm also basing my comment on how often "campaign" comes up on these boards. YMMV.

It does indeed. I see little or no change in emphasis online and in actual games on the same old overemphasis on rules (i.e. why the status quo rules are or aren't good, look how I've fixed it, no your house rules suck), metagaming (e.g. old chestnuts like paladin alignment issues) and campaign setting/worldbuilding (e.g. what setting should I use, homebrew pimping)....

...and extreme underemphasis (given their importance to the game) on adventure design and story arcs...it's much more fun to design grand macro detail like rules and empires and archdevils, whereas generating actual adventures seems too much like hard work to DMs and designers alike...apparently at least one WotC designer thought themselves above doing "a tower of orcs", they're game designers...which means to them rules tinkerers...nevermind that the rules aren't the game actually played, the adventures are, oh the rich irony and arrogance, especially when said adventures turn out to be average-to-poor in quality, no match at all for the Baldurs Gates of the world...

...and this emphasis on what is arguably ephemera such as god stats and irrelevant worldbuilding (e.g. reams of history which would suit a novel but never enter the game and tends to bore players) as the place D&D gamers love to spend most of their time thinking, writing, discusssing, cussing and daydreaming about the has been the case in D&D as far back as the earlier Dragon magazine forums. And it's still the case on these boards - metagame, rules, setting, gods/deities/archdevils ephemera everywhere, with occasional exceptions which tend to make their way into the best threads lists.

Back in the 80s and earlier, the campaign has been what D&D gamers aspire to and discuss the most. If there's been a change, other than the now extreme obsession with crunch and rules wrangling as a reaction to 2E's apparent failings, wowee, it's been subtle enough for me to miss...