Disdain for new fantasy

[Dannyalcatraz]

I like some anime. I dislike most of it.

However, I won't be the one who says something like "Keep your Anime/Video Game out of my D&D!" as long as D&D is capable of modelling more than just the anime version of swords & sorcery or videogame style fantasy combat.

Why? Because if you look at the roots of the game, there are influences from all over genre fiction (pulp, sci-fi, fantasy, horror), pop culture (of many nations) and even RW modern religion (remember the 1Ed spell Sticks to Snakes? Where did that come from? Moses, I'm looking at you!).

The game is broad and deep, and there is plenty of room for anime & video game tropes.

That said, don't expect me to include many of those tropes in my campaigns. Bo9S, which many point out as being an "anime" inspired product, I rated a solid "Meh."

OTOH, I'm still perfectly willing to play in yours if those elments are included. It would take more than a warforged with spikey violet hair (OK, a wig) wielding a sword bigger than his body to scare me away from a good gaming session.

 

[Sound of Azure]

... I could write up some house rules where all the characters are actually sentient shades of the color blue...

ZOMG!!!

 

[Henry]

I suppose I could write up some house rules where all the characters are actually sentient shades of the color blue that argue with<SNIP>

Korgoth, you just blew my mind more than a Tek Jansen novel, and I didn't think that was possible!

 

[The_Gneech]

How about hyperintelligent shades of the color blue?

"Hooloovoo: The Blueining"...

-The Gneech

 

[WizarDru]

I enjoy a great deal of anime and have for...almost 30 years now (yikes). I can easily understand why some folks don't like it's aesthetics. I don't find it problematic that people ask for anime to be kept out of D&D...I do find it problematic that they often claim something is 'anime' without any clear explanation of what element they're referring to in that context. Many of the stylistic elements of anime have no grounding in an RPG either way. Speed lines? Big Eyes? Lingering pan shots? Thrice repeated visual attacks? These are all visual and stylistic elements, which don't really translate into a rulebook. Anime is, of course, a hybrid of the Asian cinematic tradition and the American one. Just as some folks don't like noir movies or the French New Wave, they won't like anime. Nor should they be expected to.

When many non-anime fans refer to elements they don't like of anime, such as many of the elements Henry mentions, they usually apply to 'Shonen' or 'young boys' anime. Shonen anime is extremely popular in the US (as in Japan, of course)...and many of the elements that many find confounding (ridiculous weapons, overpowered heroes, young protagonists, free mixing of comedy/tragedy/action) are endemic to that genre of anime. There is, of course, a much wider selection available...but I don't expect people to go seeking them out. It's not their responsibility to do so; I do wish they'd recognize, however, that there ARE other genres to anime that don't feature these elements. This is why many anime fans (and video game fans, for that matter) bristle somewhat at the claim. I do believe it's a fair cop to same there are some folks, such as Mousferatu, who just don't like it. I don't think that he 'doesn't get it' or 'just needs to see the right thing'. It's a taste issue and a valid choice.

For myself, any medium that can feature a show like "Master Keaton", about a former SAS Master-Sergeant turned insurance investigator for Sothebys at the same time as shows like Naruto, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex, Berserk, Doreamon, Claymore and The Skull Man...well, I'm in.

 

[Cadfan]

That said, how does the shadowcaster tie into anime? I'm honestly curious, since nothing I've personally seen suggests that connection to me.

1) Look at the (as far as I can tell) Matrix inspired artwork. Matrix in turn took its inspiration from anime stylization in its character design.

You can't fight the anime. It will find its way in.

2) The shadowcaster also tends to resemble a certain character archetype that shows up in anime a lot- the non main character male designed to appeal to female viewers. He's generally an anti hero, mysterious and secretive, has powers that seem similar to the main character but which are slightly sinister, physically not that buff, but highly attractive and intelligent, and generally has much cooler clothes. Usually a dark trench coat kind of wardrobe.

There are a couple of other character classes that approach this archetype, but few realize it the way the shadowcaster does. The hexblade could have done it, if its character design had looked more like this: http://www.coolminiornot.com/160770

 

[WizarDru]

2) The shadowcaster also tends to resemble a certain character archetype that shows up in anime a lot- the non main character male designed to appeal to female viewers. He's generally an anti hero, mysterious and secretive, has powers that seem similar to the main character but which are slightly sinister, physically not that buff, but highly attractive and intelligent, and generally has much cooler clothes. Usually a dark trench coat kind of wardrobe.

How is that a specifically 'anime' archetype? Sounds a lot like Wolverine in the X-men or any brooding loner in a superhero group, for example. Could you cite a couple of examples? Because none are really coming to mind, though I'm sure there are some...I just don't think it's as prevalent in anime as you do.

 

[mmadsen]

However, why do people insist on tossing the baby out with the bathwater?

Because they're people, and that's what people do. We see the same thing whenever anyone suggests a neat idea from another game. Very few people say, Yes, that is an interesting idea from GURPS that would work in D&D; they say, If I wanted to play GURPS, I'd play GURPS! People take sides, then make wild proclamations in favor of what they already like, in toto, and against what they dislike, happily throwing out baby after baby, because they dislike the dirty bathwater.

 

[mmadsen]

How is that a specifically 'anime' archetype? Sounds a lot like Wolverine in the X-men or any brooding loner in a superhero group, for example.

It sounds like the Byronic hero even more than it sounds like Wolverine (not that he doesn't have some of those elements).

 

[WizarDru]

It sounds like the Byronic hero even more than it sounds like Wolverine (not that he doesn't have some of those elements).

Curse you and your literary contraption, mmadsen! We shall meet again...but next time, the advantage shall be MINE!