D&D General DM with too High Expectations - Advice?

[Dausuul]

What does that have to do with him pulling it off?

It strongly suggests he lacks the interpersonal skills to make a go of this. A streaming D&D campaign is not a one-man show.

 

[FrogReaver]

It strongly suggests he lacks the interpersonal skills to make a go of this. A streaming D&D campaign is not a one-man show.

I don’t see it. He ran a game for years. So obviously he has some interpersonal skills. The best interpersonal skills wouldn’t have magically got the players on board with him.

I think you are making much to harsh a judgement off a single incident.

 

[billd91]

It strongly suggests he lacks the interpersonal skills to make a go of this. A streaming D&D campaign is not a one-man show.

There's definitely something lacking and I think a willingness to partner with his players is one of them - and that certainly could be due to some failure in interpersonal skills.

 

[Retreater]

My advice to the OP's wife would be to contact some of the players that had previously offered to DM and see if they want to start a game. Invite the original DM but set it up separately, even if the original DM decides not to join she can still game with most of her friends.

This is my recommendation to her as well. Since I'm not in the group, I can't start the conversation with everyone - though I would be willing to DM for them if they decide they still want to play and none of the other players offer to DM.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

The way I see it, the desired outcome is this:

1. The DM gets to run the game he wants to run
2. The players get to play the game they want to play

The DM absolutely should run this, but as a new campaign in the same world that he's put a lot of effort into. The DM should carefully consider what level of expectations he needs from the players to make it work. He should give each of his player friends the option to participate (with those expectations) or not. If there aren't enough players on board, he should find additional players to fill up the party.

In addition, the DM should, if he is able to, offer to continue running the current campaign for his current players. Since a lot of the work he is putting in is likely world-building, it shouldn't require too much more effort to run a more casual game on the side of the one with more professional aspirations. If that is too much work for the DM, then he should let the current group know that he's only going to be able to run the heavy investment new game and not keep the old campaign going. I'm assuming he still wants to play with them, in which case he could express his interest in being a player in a game run by someone else.

Just give your wife a copy of this post and have her show it to the DM.

 

[D1Tremere]

My wife, who doesn't frequent these boards or online communities, is having an issue with her DM. Basically, he is putting a lot of time into the game to the point of GM burnout and is getting frustrated that the players (who consist of full-time employees, students, and new parents) are unable to match the out-of-game work he is putting in. He wants to begin streaming their games, start a professional DMing service, and create a "brand" (as he describes it) like Critical Role. He is giving them out of game "assignments" to work on - videos to watch, worksheets to complete, etc. He came in like a dictator for a group of friends who have been playing together for 5 years without consulting any of them about their wishes.
So I know this is definitely all second-hand information, and I don't want us to bash the guy or situation. I have given her my opinions, but I think having other experienced GMs to throw in their ideas might help - knowing they aren't invested in the situation.
What I want are tools to give my wife to help her in her conversations with this guy. Links to videos, articles, etc., she can use to talk to him about these unreasonable expectations.

The problem is, based on what you have said, the GM doesn't have unreasonable expectations. He simply has different expectations from your wife and perhaps the rest of the group. That being the case I would suggest that your wife and perhaps her fellow players should simply let the GM know they are not interested in that type of game and move on to a different GM.
The main reason these situations exist in the first place is usually due to lack of communication and resulting failure of expectations.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I don't know; that seems a set of unreasonable expectations to me if you're going to do them blind and just expect a group to go along with them without getting buy-in first thing. They're not normal things a game group routinely is expected to do.

 

[billd91]

I don't know; that seems a set of unreasonable expectations to me if you're going to do them blind and just expect a group to go along with them without getting buy-in first thing. They're not normal things a game group routinely is expected to do.

Yeah, I'm stumped why anyone would think these are normal expectations - that a group will, relatively suddenly, take on additional work and stream the game without, apparently, being actively consulted.
I'm in favor of a DM pitching they game they want to run, or even pitching a change they want to make to an ongoing game, but that comes with the expectation that players that don't want to play that particular game can respectfully bow out or pitch an alternative - not that the DM would then try to mandate that it's his game or Uno as if he's some kind of session dictator. That's just messed up.

 

[FrogReaver]

Yeah, I'm stumped why anyone would think these are normal expectations - that a group will, relatively suddenly, take on additional work and stream the game without, apparently, being actively consulted.
I'm in favor of a DM pitching they game they want to run, or even pitching a change they want to make to an ongoing game, but that comes with the expectation that players that don't want to play that particular game can respectfully bow out or pitch an alternative - not that the DM would then try to mandate that it's his game or Uno as if he's some kind of session dictator. That's just messed up.

DM - hey what do you guys think about getting serious and doing some homework and streaming.

Players - we aren’t interested

DM - that’s too bad. I’m burnt out on less serious D&D games. I wouldn’t even want to play in one. How about we play UNO or Clue?

...is this actually any better?

 

[Thomas Shey]

DM - hey what do you guys think about getting serious and doing some homework and streaming.

Players - we aren’t interested

DM - that’s too bad. I’m burnt out on less serious D&D games. I wouldn’t even want to play in one. How about we play UNO or Clue?

...is this actually any better?

Kind of? It at least doesn't just take it as a given that the players are willing to do more heavy lifting.