Do you find the Mystic Theurge overpowered?

[green slime]

You will always be behind in pure ordinary 9th+ spells:

The pure Wizard will be gaining more Epic feats, and thus be able to invest more into Improved Spellcasting, gaining higher and higher level spell slots. All the while the MT will be 3 levels behind in Spell Penetration.

Secondly Epic Spell Casting isn't really a factor until much higher level, due to the incredible DC's.

In fact, after 17th MT (Epic) level (around 27th level) the class becomes completely uninteresting. (having attained 20th caster level in both classes, the character is left to specialise in one of its two classes... or go True Necromancer *shudder*)

 

[nsruf]

I voted normal for a PrC, which means it can be slightly better than a core class if played right. This guy gets more versatile in exchange for losing raw power. Having played multiclass fighter/spellcasters on several occasions, I can assert that being unable to cast the highest level spells available to others of equal character level is a real drawback sometimes. Especially in published adventures, higher level encounters often assume that the party has a certain array of spells available - being even one level behind this "norm" can be crippling.

I share the concerns some of you have about epic levels, since these would allow a mystic theurge to get the full 20 levels of non-epic spells per day, after which multi-classing is no longer the big hindrance for spellcaster power. However, as I haven't even played close to epic levels, I may be totally wrong on that account.

 

[seasong]

This class is slightly overpowered. It is balanced from level 7 (the minimum) to level 17. There's just enough give and take that it would be a tough choice either way. Then, at 18th level, the class starts to catch up in one of the two classes. That is, the disadvantages that balanced it begin to melt away. By 20th level, there is no reason to play a pure wizard instead of this class.

To reiterate: you are NOT underpowered at the lower levels, and then overpowered at the higher levels. You are balanced at the lower levels, and then overpowered at the higher levels.

The essential differences:
Wiz 20: 4 bonus metamagic feats
Clr 3/Wiz 7/MTh 10: 1 bonus metamagic feat, 7th level divine spells

Fair trade? For a PrC, if I added more prereqs, I think it would be.

 

[Balsamic Dragon]

I think the problem I have with this class is not that it is overpowered (which it is, slightly), but that it is boring! It's a supposed prestige class but it has no interesting group, no special roleplaying requirements, and no special abilities other than bonuses to caster level. In short, no prestige. Anyone playing a multiclass caster will take it, but no two characters who take it will have anything in common other than their multiclass casting.

Game design is more than just tweaking numbers and throwing in the right number of "pluses", it's coming up with cool flavor elements that work into the system.

Balsamic Dragon

 

[green slime]

I like the lack of flavour: It gives me more freedom to add the exact flavour to suit my own campaign, without having to explain to every player in which way this PrC in my game is different from the standard.

IMC on Priests of certain gods of arcane magic will be gaining access to this.

It is also an excellent pointer to develop your own similar classes for the Druid, Sorcerer, or what have you.

 

[seasong]

I'm with green slime. This PrC isn't a PrC so much as it is a primer on how to balance that particular KIND of PrC.

 

[Storminator]

If you have a large party, and already have both a cleric and a wizard, an MT is insane. Let your buddies cast the big spells, you Bull STR, Cat's Grace, Endurance, etc the entire party. At Wiz3/Clr3/MT7 you can have 12 2nd level spells per day.

GMW from the wizard side, Magic Vestments from the cleric side...

A pure buffing machine.

PS

 

[drnuncheon]

It does make me wonder what we're going to see from the revised Spellsword - I suspect it will wind up being +1 caster level/level also (which will make my spellsword player quite happy). I further suspect that caster multiclassing is going to become very popular.

I wonder if the 3eRev wizard is going to get anything else. Right now he's giving up what, 2 feats in return for 7th level cleric spells? Ooo, big cost.

Hopefully the wizard and the sorcerer give you reasons to stay with the base class instead of PrCing as soon as possible.

J

 

[Charwoman Gene]

Okay, let me be revise.


My main grudge is with Caster PrC's in general.
I think Wizards and especially Sorcerors need a boost at upper levels to fend off the hordes of "+ Spells per Day" PrCs...
I also think that Domain spells should be tied to Cleric level, not level of Cleric Spell castable...

I'd like the requirements to be stricter, I'd restrict it to Clerics of Boccob and maybe Wee Jas or Vecna IMC, but even as is, isn't too bad and is nicely balanced up to level 16.

I'd probably boost the Skill requirements in order to balance it perfectly. How? 11 ranks of Spellcraft, probably. Gotta be 8th level. I'd really just like to see 4/4 instead of 3/3.

I'd also like to see a Druid Friendly version. Swap the Knowledge(Religion) for Knowledge (Nature) and you've got an awesome combo...

 

[Storminator]

<SNIP>

I'd also like to see a Druid Friendly version. Swap the Knowledge(Religion) for Knowledge (Nature) and you've got an awesome combo...

I think druids would hate this class. Druids actually have class abilities to lose. No Wildshaping if you're an MT, and you lose the good Fort save (ok, clerics do too).

PS