Does anyone want to talk about D&D?

Skill challenges interest me, an I don't think I have them quite right for my group yet. Still a bit too much roll roll and not enough role role. I think I need to have floating bonuses and penalties to help the role role.

Well, I am sure I will get it. Some good advice here.
 

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Dice4Hire, there's a big debate about skill challenges on the "Real reason the game has changed" thread - I wouldn't say it's worth reading (a lot of tedious back and forth) but it has helped me clarify a few things about running skill challenges.

I think there are 2 or 3 key things: (1) you as GM have to have a very clear idea of the situation the PCs are in, and ways in which it might develop in response to their actions; (2) when thinking about those ways it might develop, don't be locked into thinking of it just in terms of ingame consequences of failed skill use - be prepared to use a failed skill check, or even a failed skill challenge, as an excuse to introduce some complication which is (from the point of view of the gameworld) causally unrelated, but is (from the point of view of the players at the table) thematically/story appropriate; (3) don't railroad - so even though you've worked out a few ideas in advance, be prepared to follow the lead of the players, and to push the situation (and the PCs) in unexpected directions.

For an example of number (2) above at work, look at the sample of play in the Rules Compendium, if you've got it. At the end of that challenge, the players fail a Streetwise check to investigate a building, and therefore fail the skill challenge overall (3rd failed skill check). In response, the GM has some thugs turn up and attack them even though the thugs weren't hanging around and weren't part of the Streetwise check. Earlier in the challenge the thugs had been brushed off by a successful Intimidate check. So what the GM has done here is to respond to the failed challenge by introducing a complication which is thematically/story relevant - these thugs have been introduced earlier in the challenge, and so their aggressive return makes a nice way of ending the challenge with a meaningful failure.
 


In the game I'm running, the players have taken a break from trying to solve the mystery of the world they have been exploring to go to Sigil for supplies, where they promptly got jumped by a mousling street gang (guess what I recently bought from Reaper?). After beating up the gang, the PCs have convinced them that having dimension-travelling patrons could be useful, and that they should sign on to run operations locally for the PCs. Now, the PCs need to find a library and a vendor with skulls from other dimensions. The skulls are because their method of dimensional travel involves a ritual that targets a portal based on six skulls, and they need three more to get where they want to go, which is the homeworld of the were-panthers that have invaded the fairy-tale plane they found which turns into a nightmare realm at night.

Meanwhile, one of my coworkers is starting up a Dark Sun game on Monday, and I'm quite looking forward to finalizing the characters we've been discussing and getting to play for a while.
 

I am currently absolutely loving the 4e round-robin campaign I'm in. I get to play. I get to DM. I get to try out wacky new options every few months. Since about September, I've been able to play a Gnome Assassin, a Dwarf Bard, a Githyanki Pyromancer, and I've been able to DM an adventure about the rise of the Nyx, the First Night, the Primordial of darkness and fear, as she began corrupting the youth of a small down (and killing off the adults).

I'm looking forward to my next little adventure, too. :)

I like playing round-robin style, too. It's a great mix of options and playing and DMing. I keep thinking about running a Planescape 4e campaign or something, but the Round Robin is such fun...

Hmmm. Actually, if I could get about 3-4 other people together, I might run that on the side....hmmmm....

My mouth is also watering for Zeitgeist. It promises to define Awesome in new and interesting ways. ;)
 

KM, have you had any issues having to pick up new PCs like that? (I'm assuming they don't all start at 1st level - maybe I'm wrong in making that assumption.)

Also, tell us more about Nyx, please, and an actual play report would be nice if you have the time/inclination - I'm hoping to run a town-based adventure soon with Dagon-worshipping prophets of doom, and ideas (even superficially unrelated ideas) would be helpful.
 

Our playtesting group has had a recent shake-up due to real life reasons. Not all of the original playtesters can play on the same day, so we have a bunch on haitus.

I am currently running a conversion of The Cradle of Madness from Dungeon #87. The original module is for level 6 characters, and I am running it for three level 3-4 RCFG PCs, none of which is a caster. One of these (playing a 3rd level halfling rogue) started the game with this session with no previous knowledge of RCFG, and with knowledge of D&D gleaned primarily through video games.

SPOILERS, therefore, follow.

This is basically a "rescue the princess" adventure, where the PCs are seeking the daughter of Lord Danwick, and are expecting to receive a house as a reward.

In the previous session, the group defeated the ruined keep's guards, got into the temple below the ruined keep, passed down the stairs, encountered the disintigration trap (one PC nearly died, but by shifting his saving throw from a Reaction to an Action, he was able to gain a +4 bonus and made it). The characters dealt with the black tentacles and some guards.

In this session, the group began examining the temple beyond the hexagonal rooms. The first was a closet/cloak room, which took them only a short time to deal with. They then proceeded into the dining room. Two doors exit this room.

After a short time, an ogre enters the dining room from one door. The PCs are wearing cultist robes, so it simply starts clearing the table. After its second trip to clear the table, the PCs decide to question it.

RCFG has a "Get the Drop" mechanic that allows you to, effectively, hold a creature at gunpoint. It isn't automatically successful, but it makes these situations more dangerous. The ogre, though, was a dedicated cultist, and not in a talking mood. When he went for his cleaver, the two PCs with ranged weapons shot at him....failing to kill him. Initiative is rolled.....But one of the PCs leaped over the table, attacking with a katar, and finishing him off (Acrobatics gamble for more damage; if the skill check had been failed, the PC would have ended his Action on the table within the ogre's reach).

One door leads into a guardroom, from which dogs are heard barking. The PCs make a quick plan, open the door, and deal with the six guard dogs. The ruleset encourages gambling skill checks to gain bonuses in combat, so combat is interesting wth different PCs trying all sorts of different things. Moreover, based on the characters' strengths and weaknesses, each PC begins to organically develop his own combat style.

Within is another door that is obviously held closed (one one PC had dogs that refused to approach it, and so the PCs left it alone). They spent some time looting the room, then examined the kitchen (where the ogre had come from) and the pantry. The PCs began to plan to take all of the furniture from the place when they were done.

Proceeding back into the main hallway, the PCs found the library, where they discovered more clues, were confronted by a ghost, and eventually fled. (The players have found a number of magic weapons over many game sessions, but for some reason tend not to remember them, to store them in a bank vault, to not examine them, etc., and so had no magic weapons with them.) The ghost could not follow, so they went to another door.

This was the jail/torture area, a series of three rooms. The sleeping jailor was dealt with via a Stealth check and a coup-de-grace. Anyone who has read the module will know why the PCs decided against searching his pestilent body. But they did scoop the magic shield and mace (and realized that they were probably magical, with thoughts of wailing on the ghost). They then found the jail cell (and corspe) and the half-elf being tortured on a rack controlled by a complex series of chains and pulleys.

The players elected to attempt to figure out a way to deal with that on their own, using their own reasoning rather than the dice. At that point, we had to end the session, because the new player had to go to work.

All in all, the session lasted from approx. 6:30 to 9 pm, and was a heck of a lot of fun for all involved.


RC
 
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That sounds awesom RC.

I'm running two PF campaigns. One for my best friend, his wife and mine. The other for my wife and another married couple. It had been a couple of years since I had played with my friend. WoW and kids and work and all that stuff we just didn't get together. I forgot how much fun he is to DM for. He is always doing something creative. Let me tell you about this last session.

The PC's had just crossed a rope bridge. It was big enough to handle horses bot not so big that it didn't sway perilously. They were ambushed by a large orcish warband. I thought they would just tough it out but they ran back across the bridge. I sent the orcs on after them worried that they would cut the bridge down. They didn't but they did get it swinging violently enough to twist it and dump the orcs to their deaths. Good times.
 

KM, have you had any issues having to pick up new PCs like that? (I'm assuming they don't all start at 1st level - maybe I'm wrong in making that assumption.)

Nah, we have everyone always at the same level. We've had some treasure-distribution weirdness (since new characters come with different and often customized stuff, while old characters have more GP and random stuff) that I've been thinking of a way to solve (inherent bonuses?) but that's really the only complication.

The game is really "episodic." Each month is a new, largely self-contained adventure by a different DM. It might have some tenuous ties to what came before (and we're kind of assuming it's set in the same world, in the same general region), but they don't have a whole lot to do with each other. So when a new character comes in, it's at the beginning of something new, rather than in the middle of anything. We've got an off-screen "Adventurer's Guild" as a plot device, who can assign us missions and then the characters it assigns missions to are those that we happen to be playing in this instance.

It's actually really, really convenient, and I am very much enjoying playing like this, just 'cuz I get to try out so much stuff, and get to play in so many different kinds of adventures.

Also, tell us more about Nyx, please, and an actual play report would be nice if you have the time/inclination - I'm hoping to run a town-based adventure soon with Dagon-worshipping prophets of doom, and ideas (even superficially unrelated ideas) would be helpful.

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The adventure focused on an isolated farming village that the PC's arrived "too late to save," the priestess they were supposed to be contacting already dead, along with, apparently, the whole town. The town was covered in sticky strands of silk like a light dusting of snow. After getting glimpses of what might have caused the disaster, they were "apprehended" by a gang of children, lead by a self-important, egotistical, 16 year old girl who has appointed herself queen of the land. The girl, it turns out, was serving under the priestess they were supposed to contact. There was also rumored to be an older boy that she would listen to, who had run into the forest in protest of her rule (and to save his little sister from the pernicious fey that had appeared there).

The party tracked down the boy. The boy wanted their help to destroy the fey that had kidnapped his little sister (and many of the young folk of the town), a creature known as The Piper, based off of a vicious child-eating take on the Pied Piper. In battling the Piper, they also discovered the origins of the strands of silk: he was aided by moths that caused nightmares and hallucinations, whose wings could slice like blades.

The party explored some ruins below the farming village's temple (a temple of Sehanine the Moon Goddess) where the girl had apparently gone just before the night took all of the parents in town. They discovered there a ritual designed to summon a primordial that she had unwittingly performed, in an effort to protect herself from her abusive father. It had made the moths appear, and had also caused an un-ending night to fall over the town.

With the boy's help, they convinced the girl that she had made a mistake, and so, to make it right, she sacrificed herself, giving them a pathway to the citadel in the sky, where they could slay the primordial. The pathway was formed of strands of sticky silk, and, on the way up, they had to battle moths while suspended in midair. At the pinnacle, they entered the castle, and confronted the Primordial. They managed to drive her off long enough to release the place where she had stored all of the town's good feelings and emotions that she had stolen: in a cocoon, embodied in a golden butterfly of prismatic glory.

I created Nyx as the "Primordial Night," the darkness into which the world was created, the fear of the darkness that lurks in every child, the Thing Under The Bed, the Un-Mother, a perverse Dark Queen who every being knew to instinctively fear, because she was the first primordial who was defeated in the wars, and the oldest, and the one who could never truly be eradicated, because she was there whenever you closed your eyes or had a nightmare. The moths pulled her chariot into the world via a girl who only wanted to be protected, and wound up making the whole world more exposed than it was before.

Stats-wise, I used Purple Dragons for the moths, and a re-skin of Shar for Nyx herself. I also used something else to re-skin the Piper (some fey with some charming powers) but I've since forgotten it. It was one of my earlier DMing attempts, so it sort of suffered from extended grind, in part because I used a lot of Elites and Solos. But one of the great things about the round-robin is that you get to see how other DM's address the problem. One of them decided to use mostly lower-level foes. Another runs mostly from modules, which tend to keep the combat variety high. A third had an actual traditional "dungeon" where encounters were keyed to rooms, and resting was up to us. I'm thinking that for future Big Battles I might go with more of a "skill challenge combat" style, where, in order to actually fight the enemy, you need to perform various skill checks. Rather than inflating HP or AC or anything, you instead have to get 5 successes (or something) before you can actually injure it, and once you injure it, maybe it goes down quite a bit faster.
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Not sure how much that helps your Dagon idea, but I'd say try to keep the party isolated. My PC's were the only adults within miles that weren't dead, far away from any other town, and some were suffering from a disease I had introduced earlier (the Piper's minions were wererats, so I afflicted them with Filth Fever -- though I wouldn't recommend 4e's disease rules necessarily). I think it helped them feel far away from anything that could help them, very apart from the world. This makes the game a little creepier, since the PC's know it depends on them and only them. If they fail, no one else is going to come and save them. No one will even know they have failed for months. The world would have this cancer growing stronger the entire time.

Hope that helps!
 

On Thursday, I had a PC chased by several thousand murderous pigeons. Turned into one of the three best skill challenges in the past few years! Best of all, prep took maybe 5 minutes.

(skill challenge details here for those interested.)
 

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