DriveThruRPG Exclusivity

[lrsach01]

What about those people who don't use Microsoft? I'm a Linux user. Have been for years. All of my pdf's open easily in the 5.0 version of Acrobat reader but I understand the 6.0 version is required. Adobe doesn't have a 6.0 for linux let alone the .NET backbone. In other words, DTRPG wants to sell me pdf versions of material that is only a few dollars cheaper than the print version AND I would have to buy WindowsXP. For some people, this would also mean a new computer! Luckily I'm a comp-net so my machine is pretty new but some people aren't so lucky.

Bottom line is, unless a DRM pdf is significantly cheaper, there is no advantage over the print version.

 

[Flyspeck23]

People run companies, not the other way around. I have no idea how this will end up, since I can't say anything definitive until I see some hard data, but if people are unhappy it's our duty to our customers to try to make them happy.

Well, at my desk, the company runs me

We all make mistakes. If one's willing to correct these mistakes, that's all well and good... if he even sees them, that is. Emotions are running a little wild right now, so I honestly can't tell who's right and who's wrong - those companies that think DRM is a good thing, or those (including my own, and therefore me ) that don't.

My shaolin freelancer told me that I'm right, and while that doesn't say much, he's at least a lot more level-headed than most (including me). Guess that's what this whole shalin thing's all about...

 

[Flyspeck23]

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But I am saying you need to look at this from a publisher's point of view. Few, if any, of them are tech heads.

But most, if not all, (hopefully) are customers too.

See, TOGC is a little flyspeck of a company, but for any decision I make I try to look at it from a customer's perspective. One result of that was our Gaming Group License (one customer, up to 8 people using the PDFs).

If one person buys some material, eBook or not, he or she is bound to share that with his gaming group. Why would anyone want to discourage that?

 

[The Sigil]

THUD!

*the sound of mr.c's jaw dropping on the floor*

Your kidding right, or being sarcastic or something.Please say yes! There are actually people that are suprised by the amount of negativity regarding DRM on rpg products? Please let me know who those people are, then i can make a new list "game designers that actually life in the fantasy world they design"...

Sorry, but if there was done any research beyond the corporate dribble DRM selling companies gave, then it should be obvious that most of the non-corporate computer literate consumers absolutely hate the idea of DRM.

Ditto. I posted a nice, drawn-out post on Monte's boards that I'll not re-post here, but the bottom line to me is this...

1.) Any publisher who thinks DRM will inhibit piracy in the slightest is misinformed or simply delusional (I refer you to my .sig).

2.) Any publisher who has been in the PDF field (i.e., catering to computer users) for as long as Malhavoc has and says they're surprised by the backlash... well... let's just say I find that a dubious claim at best.

The "we're surprised" bit might work for FFG. It just doesn't wash for me with Malhavoc, which has been an innovator in electronic publishing for years and I would think SHOULD have some idea about the general demographics of their customers - specifically that those who recognize the value of a PDF are generally computer-literate types (and I would expect you to note that computer literate types generally dislike DRM with about the same fervor with which cats generally dislike dobermans).

I think you'll find that in the mind of most computer literate types, the "appropriate" response to introducing DRM to a computer-literate customer base and receiving the inevitable backlash is to "back away from DRM as fast as humanly possible." If you quickly and immediately change course, they can probably chalk it up to, "he's just not computer-literate" and let it go. But the longer it takes you to retreat from that position, the greater number of customers there are that will not forgive you even if you do eventually decide to drop it.

I happen to be a "forgiving" customer who won't buy anything DRM but will likely come back once it's dropped. There are others who will never buy from you again now that you've broached it (see: Turbotax). There are still others who will buy from you if you come off DRM in a day but if you stay on for a day will never buy from you again. Repeat the previous sentence with "two days" and "a week" and "a month" etc. substituted for "a day."

Basically, by broaching DRM, you have instantly and permanently lost some customers. You have instantly and temporarily lost others, who will come back if you remove DRM. BUT, the longer you stay with DRM, the more customers move from the "Temporarily Lost" pool to "Permanently Lost" pool no matter what you subsequently do.

I'm not telling you how to run your business. But I am telling you that my experience with PDF users is that they are also computer savvy. My experience with computer-savvy users is that they fall into the pattern above. That's not a threat, it's friendly advice.

--The Sigil

 

[LeaderDesslok]

Late last night I was finally able to connect to the site and login. I´ve given my address info before, but why was my phone number a required field? I HATE giving out my phone number online!

I went browsing and decided I´d get the free Witchcraft core rulebook from Eden Studios to give the site and DRM a try. I downoaded easily enough, but I cancelled the activation of DRM to see what happens. Surprisingly, the file still opened up without a hitch. My version of Adobe Reader 6 is only a week old, so I know I didn´t do anything to activate DRM. I don´t understand how it seems to be magically activated on my machine.

One last thing: The Eden Studios entry for Witchcraft says the book usually sells for $35, so I figured this was a special deal for the new site. Well, this morning I realized that I had already downloaded the Witchcraft core rules from RPGNow.com back in August of last year for free! As I recall, they either were either coming out with a new edition or weren´t going print format anymore, so they were giving away the core book for free. The Drivethrurpg site makes it look like you´re getting a huge deal. (Note: RPGNow is no longer offering the core rulebook on its site).

I have confirmed...
* DRM is not active on my machine
* The file is secured by DRM
* I can print to my heart´s content
* I can copy the file to another folder with a different name, send it to a friend, and he can open it and print it
* When I select individual text elements to copy, it still tells me that I can only make 10 copies to clipboard in 10 days (retarded)

Somehow my PDF file is kinda sorta secure.

 

[ngenius]

Great analysis of DRM technology

This is a very interesting form, here on ENWorld.

Very detailed and informative!!! But you guys should really check the MASSIVE, and I mean massively long list of comments on RPG.net

DriveThruRPG _discussion

As a user of PDF products, I personally think that restrictive security actually annoys the legitimate users more than the pirates. The pirates always have ways of breaking into most secure products.

Fact is, once a product has been downloaded to a laptop, there is already a security breach. The DRM technology has only been designed to reduce the ease with which normal consumers would attempt piracy. The music industry tried to deter MP3 but failed. What they ended up doing was to accomodate MP3s. I think that a well established site like RPGNow has created a lot of "good-will" that the gaming community who buys their products there, generally tend to shun piracy without needing forced technology protections.

Anyways, I will first test the free products then some of the cheaper ones using DriveThruRPG before making judgement.

Also, for the security buffs, please read the following on DCMA and other issues. The news is old but shows what hackers have in mind.

http://www.linuxworld.com.au/index.php?id=823764025

Also remeber Skylarov, the Russian who was guilty of hacking Adobe's DRM technology?

Just my ideas.

 

[Dana_Jorgensen]

PDF publishing, and even the Internet, are still big scary things for most RPG companies. Compare the typical RPG website to, say, ESPN.com or Amazon. RPG publishers are far behind the curve. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the only full-time RPG employee who understands C, Java, and Perl.

Well, you can start going into shock now. along with being able to code in those languages, I can also handle Visual basic and its numerous offspring, PHP, ECMAscript, Python, Tin, Macromedia's Actionscript and its offspring,PASCAL, Scheme, TCL, Smalltalk, and FORTRAN. I can probably still program in basic and assembly, but its been at least 15 years since I bothered with either. And I know numerous part-timers and freelancers are quite capable in the same languages as you as well.

Sure, there are a lot of smaller companies that have gone with PDFs, and even Wizards go into the game early on, but most of the mid-tier publishers and industry people are terrified of piracy and distrustful of PDF technology.

Personally, I tend to think this terror is a side effect of years of hearing about Palladium's irrational fears of losing the rights to their works if so much as a single article gets published by some other company's magazines.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But I am saying you need to look at this from a publisher's point of view. Few, if any, of them are tech heads.

I have looked at it from the publisher's point of view. However, I believe the publishers are also only looking at DRM from Adobe's point of view, which is obviously going to be biased to the point of making a turd shine like a diamond. How much research did you guys do into the flaws of Adobe's DRM models?

 

[Dana_Jorgensen]

Late last night I was finally able to connect to the site and login. I´ve given my address info before, but why was my phone number a required field? I HATE giving out my phone number online!

I went browsing and decided I´d get the free Witchcraft core rulebook from Eden Studios to give the site and DRM a try. I downoaded easily enough, but I cancelled the activation of DRM to see what happens. Surprisingly, the file still opened up without a hitch. My version of Adobe Reader 6 is only a week old, so I know I didn´t do anything to activate DRM. I don´t understand how it seems to be magically activated on my machine.

One last thing: The Eden Studios entry for Witchcraft says the book usually sells for $35, so I figured this was a special deal for the new site. Well, this morning I realized that I had already downloaded the Witchcraft core rules from RPGNow.com back in August of last year for free! As I recall, they either were either coming out with a new edition or weren´t going print format anymore, so they were giving away the core book for free. The Drivethrurpg site makes it look like you´re getting a huge deal. (Note: RPGNow is no longer offering the core rulebook on its site).

I have confirmed...
* DRM is not active on my machine
* The file is secured by DRM
* I can print to my heart´s content
* I can copy the file to another folder with a different name, send it to a friend, and he can open it and print it
* When I select individual text elements to copy, it still tells me that I can only make 10 copies to clipboard in 10 days (retarded)

Somehow my PDF file is kinda sorta secure.

Hmmm... was acrobat reader 6 a clean installation, or an installation over a previous version of acrobat reader?

 

[The Mad Kaiser]

I'm not telling you how to run your business. But I am telling you that my experience with PDF users is that they are also computer savvy. My experience with computer-savvy users is that they fall into the pattern above. That's not a threat, it's friendly advice.

--The Sigil

Sig, you are dead on.

 

[BryonD]

But I am saying you need to look at this from a publisher's point of view.

The correct PoV for business is the direction that the money flows.