D&D 5E Drudge, a magical laborer background - advice sought

[DEFCON 1]

You have equated "power" with combat, which is fine to do, but ignores the design of 5th edition.

Again, the question was about tools, and which type to include. If someone asks about X and your answer is about Y, are you helping answer the question?

If your question was about tools, then why when you quoted me in your response did you use my point about 'two cantrips', rather than my point of '1 tool / 1 cantrip'? I thought your reply was suggesting that there was nothing wrong with giving 2 cantrips, which is what I was bouncing off of. If that's not what you meant, then I misunderstood.

My point about 1 tool and 1 cantrip plus my vote of 'Any tool' is what I'm assuming you were actually looking for. That's my answer to X.

 

[bedir than]

I think a background that grants one skill, one tool, a non-scaling cantrip from an non-optimal list, and a Background Feature would probably be fine.
So yes, having Drudge include a tool would be fine.

This is basically where most of the fantastical backgrounds are operating. With the Drudge I'm encountering a thought that most "Artisan Tools" don't fit my vision of them being menial laborers, ditch-diggers, fence builders, etc. There are a few that seem relevant.

My current lean is towards a list of those tools with pick one and a list of utility cantrips (currently at 7) with a pick one.

 

[bedir than]

Published my WIP about the Remarkable Drudge over on my blog.

Athletics, one of a few tools, one of a handful of utility cantrips, a feature that represents their hard work (may be overpowered).

I also added Farmer's Tools, something that for some reason didn't exist already.

 

[Greenstone.Walker]

Possibly a silly question - why would an employer pay someone to use mage hand when they could pay someone to use their actual hands (which can carry more weight, use tools, aqnd do two-handed things)?

 

[Faolyn]

Possibly a silly question - why would an employer pay someone to use mage hand when they could pay someone to use their actual hands (which can carry more weight, use tools, aqnd do two-handed things)?

Potentially for use in hazmat situations?

 

[Kobold Stew]

Published my WIP about the Remarkable Drudge over on my blog.

Athletics, one of a few tools, one of a handful of utility cantrips, a feature that represents their hard work (may be overpowered).

I also added Farmer's Tools, something that for some reason didn't exist already.

It's a cool idea, but it isn't balanced as it is, in my opinion.
1. cantrips are a significant ability, and all of the ones you list are high-use. Shape Water, Mould Earth, and Mage Hand are all very useful, regularly taken by players, and the others are distinctive flavour of specific spellcasters. Many variant humans take a feat to have access to cantrips.
2. The Feature is incredibly powerful, allowing players to overcome one of the biggest challenges in the edition. Features tend to give NARRATIVE benefits, not mechanical ones as here.

Both of these aspects make this more powerful as a background than others.

3. On top of that you are giving a skill (a very useful skill that one can benefit from regardless of strength) and a tool as well.

If you are amping up other backgrounds and that's what you want, great. But this does not seem on a par with other bacvkgrounds (and it is at the level of a very desirable feat).

 

[bedir than]

But this does not seem on a par with other bacvkgrounds (and it is at the level of a very desirable feat).

As a reminder, we know that every background is more powerful than several useful feats. Skilled gives three skills, so less than a Background. Skill Expert gives a +1, a skill, and expertise. Prodigy gives a skill, a language, a tool, and expertise (limited by race). Magic Initiate merely gives two cantrips and 1 use of 1 1st level spell.

The math around balance means that a single cantrip is worth slightly more than a skill, but not as much as two skills.

The Remarkable Drudge is then limited to specific cantrips, thereby reducing the value a bit (not much, but a bit). There is also little to know synergy between having advantage on certain ability checks (no saving throws or attack roles) and gaining an additional cantrip for spellcasters.

 

[bedir than]

Possibly a silly question - why would an employer pay someone to use mage hand when they could pay someone to use their actual hands (which can carry more weight, use tools, aqnd do two-handed things)?

A use case might be that the person who is really good at lifting stuff left their hammer 30 feet away and they're up on a ladder. Rather than climb down, walk over, climb up and hammer, this individual just has their magic go get the item. Did this come up because my hammer was far away and I wanted to be lazy? Absolutely.

Much of the drudge came about because I was building fences or furniture or digging ditches or building a retaining wall.

 

[Kobold Stew]

We disagree about the relative importance of giving cantrips and giving a feature with a specific mechanical benefit (that counters exhaustion).

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Published my WIP about the Remarkable Drudge over on my blog.

Athletics, one of a few tools, one of a handful of utility cantrips, a feature that represents their hard work (may be overpowered).

Definitely overpowered.
Background features are narrative and social features generally for use in RP situations. Not combat bonuses.

I also added Farmer's Tools, something that for some reason didn't exist already.

Most of the time, what you're actually doing with farming tools does not require a lot of skill. Just hard work. Being good at farming is more about knowing what needs doing when and actually doing it, as well as a bunch of subsidiary skills

As a reminder, we know that every background is more powerful than several useful feats. Skilled gives three skills, so less than a Background. Skill Expert gives a +1, a skill, and expertise. Prodigy gives a skill, a language, a tool, and expertise (limited by race). Magic Initiate merely gives two cantrips and 1 use of 1 1st level spell.

The math around balance means that a single cantrip is worth slightly more than a skill, but not as much as two skills.

I mean you're entitled to hold that position, but as a reminder, a background is considerably less powerful than most feats. The closest it gets level to is Skilled, which is generally regarded as awful. Prodigy is much more powerful, since Expertise is generally better than another proficiency. Magic initiate is thought of as good, since cantrips are highly prized and generally very limited at low levels. Most spellcasters I've played would have happily given up access to a couple of first level spells for cantrips if that were possible.

The Remarkable Drudge is then limited to specific cantrips, thereby reducing the value a bit (not much, but a bit). There is also little to know synergy between having advantage on certain ability checks (no saving throws or attack roles) and gaining an additional cantrip for spellcasters.

The cantrips selected are very powerful and versatile, and generally in high demand.
This isn't like a magewright casting: this is full-out access to the full cantrip, and a background consisting of only the cantrip, maybe a tool, and an actual Background Feature (rather than the suggested one) would probably still get use.