D&D (2024) Dual Wielding

[Crimson Longinus]

Another thing that is being overlooked in the shenanigans is that DROPPING a weapon now has the same action economy as sheathing it. It's not free. It's once as part of your attack with the attack action.

That is bizarre though. Does this mean characters cannot let go of anything they're holding without taking an action?

 

[FitzTheRuke]

That is bizarre though. Does this mean characters cannot let go of anything they're holding without taking an action?

Bizarre, maybe. But it's the rule. To your question: I would assume that is what your free object interaction is still there for. Just not for weapons.

Which is probably good, because there's too many ways where you ought to never get a dropped weapon back, but it's usually handwaved. Not to mention all the tines I've seen people switch back to weapons that they dropped two rounds ago and 40 feet away.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Bizarre, maybe. But it's the rule. To your question: I would assume that is what your free object interaction is still there for. Just not for weapons.

I think it is utterly ludicrous beyond belief if one actually enforced such a rule. You could not let go of things except on your own turn. Like you literally couldn't even hand things to other people.

Which is probably good, because there's too many ways where you ought to never get a dropped weapon back, but it's usually handwaved. Not to mention all the tines I've seen people switch back to weapons that they dropped two rounds ago and 40 feet away.

I've never seen that. Sure picking up weapons after the battle is usually handwaved, as long as there is no particular reason the characters could have not done that. And you have the same issue with thrown weapons anyway, and that come up way more often; and unless you suggest that all thrown weapons should magically return to you, you need to remember that you no longer have it once you throw it.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

I think it is utterly ludicrous beyond belief if one actually enforced such a rule. You could not let go of things except on your own turn. Like you literally couldn't even hand things to other people.

What do you mean, do you usually hand things to people when it's not your turn? Wouldn't they use their own "free interaction" to take the thing from you on their turn?

I've never seen that. Sure picking up weapons after the battle is usually handwaved, as long as there is no particular reason the characters could have not done that. And you have the same issue with thrown weapons anyway, and that come up way more often; and unless you suggest that all thrown weapons should magically return to you, you need to remember that you no longer have it once you throw it.

I've seen it quite common (not like session-to-session common, but I play a LOT and it's happened many times over the years) that people forget that they dropped a weapon for some action economy and then switch back to it later. Sometimes, no one catches it until after an attack has been resolved, and there's nothing I hate more than backtracking.

At least by the new rules you can assume that they sheathed it. It's a little weird, but then, so is dropping weapons on the ground - historically people didn't generally (purposefully) treat their weapons with such disrespect unless they were really desperate.

 

[Charlaquin]

They needed it so you could open doors. But object interaction no longer has anything to do with drawing or stowing weapons.

Did they though? I don’t know, I can’t imagine myself ever telling a player “sorry, you already opened one door this turn, you can’t open another.” The idea that interacting with the environment needs a special category within the action economy instead of just being something that happens incidentally as part of your normal movement and actions during your turn has always seemed pretty silly to me. I imagine this “free object interaction” will continue being completely handwaved away, just as it has been for the past decade.

Another thing that is being overlooked in the shenanigans is that DROPPING a weapon now has the same action economy as sheathing it. It's not free. It's once as part of your attack with the attack action.

To be fair, dropping items to get around the restriction to one “free object interaction” per turn was always kind of cheesy. Like, yeah, sure, simply letting go of a sword takes less time and effort than putting it properly into a scabbard. But that functionally meant that the “free object interaction” was less restrictive on weapon swapping than originally intended, at the cost of the narrative being really silly, with characters routinely dropping their weapons on the floor on purpose, only to bend over and pick them back up a few seconds later.

With the new rules for drawing and stowing weapons being so generous anyway, I’m more than ok with having the slight simulation fail or dropping a weapon taking up as much of your action economy as it does to sheathe the weapon, if it also means we no longer have the major flavor/narrative fail of constantly dropping weapons and picking them back up off the ground.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

What do you mean, do you usually hand things to people when it's not your turn? Wouldn't they use their own "free interaction" to take the thing from you on their turn?

They could, except you cannot let go of it because it is no longer your turn!

I've seen it quite common (not like session-to-session common, but I play a LOT and it's happened many times over the years) that people forget that they dropped a weapon for some action economy and then switch back to it later. Sometimes, no one catches it until after an attack has been resolved, and there's nothing I hate more than backtracking.

At least by the new rules you can assume that they sheathed it. It's a little weird, but then, so is dropping weapons on the ground - historically people didn't generally (purposefully) treat their weapons with such disrespect unless they were really desperate.

But again, this is an issue that way more commonly affects thrown weapons, and the change does nothing for them. So you need to remember which weapons you have with you anyway.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

Did they though? I don’t know, I can’t imagine myself ever telling a player “sorry, you already opened one door this turn, you can’t open another.” The idea that interacting with the environment needs a special category within the action economy instead of just being something that happens incidentally as part of your normal movement and actions during your turn has always seemed pretty silly to me. I imagine this “free object interaction” will continue being completely handwaved away, just as it has been for the past decade.

No, I agree with you - but you see a lot of arguments that try to claim that you can't do things if the rules don't tell you you can (and vice-versa). At some point, common sense really ought to come into play.

To be fair, dropping items to get around the restriction to one “free object interaction” per turn was always kind of cheesy.

Absolutely!

Like, yeah, sure, simply letting go of a sword takes less time and effort than putting it properly into a scabbard. But that functionally meant that the “free object interaction” was less restrictive on weapon swapping than originally intended, at the cost of the narrative being really silly, with characters routinely dropping their weapons on the floor on purpose, only to bend over and pick them back up a few seconds later.

Yeah, and sometimes while a monster is looming over them - a thing that would get you killed 9 times out of 10 in any remotely real setting.

With the new rules for drawing and stowing weapons being so generous anyway, I’m more than ok with having the slight simulation fail or dropping a weapon taking up as much of your action economy as it does to sheathe the weapon, if it also means we no longer have the major flavor/narrative fail of constantly dropping weapons and picking them back up off the ground.

Me too. Instead of all the weirdness of why you'd willingly disarm yourself, how you'd pick it back up without getting killed, how time sometimes has to reassert itself when you forget that you did it and then remember, and the effort of remembering where you left it - the only weirdness is that you can't drop it more quickly than you can put it away.

I prefer the latter. It basically just enforces that everyone actually cares about their weapons enough to properly sheath them like their weapon trainers taught them. Respect the weapon.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

They could, except you cannot let go of it because it is no longer your turn!

That is not supported by the rules in any way.

But again, this is an issue that way more commonly affects thrown weapons, and the change does nothing for them. So you need to remember which weapons you have with you anyway.

Sure, but now ONLY them.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

That is not supported by the rules in any way.

But...

That is bizarre though. Does this mean characters cannot let go of anything they're holding without taking an action?

Bizarre, maybe. But it's the rule. To your question: I would assume that is what your free object interaction is still there for. Just not for weapons.

Here it seems that you think that's the rule...

Sure, but now ONLY them.

But in my experience thrown weapons are like 90% of "dropped weapon" situations, so getting rid of that 10% seems pretty immaterial. Not that I particularly strongly oppose easy weapon swapping, as long as it doesn't lead to weird one-handed dual wielding, or using two-handers whilst benefitting from a shield etc, that the new rules allow.

 

[ECMO3]

Another thing that is being overlooked in the shenanigans is that DROPPING a weapon now has the same action economy as sheathing it. It's not free. It's once as part of your attack with the attack action.

Really? I know this is the case for "stowing" the weapon, I did not know it was for dropping the weapon and that really makes no sense.

So I guess if you get hit with the disarm attack or the fear spell or heat metal or something that makes you drop your weapon you just don't drop it?

If true, this is another example of not adequately proofing the rules!