Dwarven Weapon Training and Adventurer's Vault Weapons

[Orcus Porkus]

What's the entry under 'Group' on the table? Is it "Axe, Spear"?

-Hyp.

Quote from Adventurer's Vault:
Urgrosh; +2 proficiency; d12/d8 damage; 30 gp; 12 lb.; Group: Axe, spear; Properties: Defensive, off-hand

 

[Hypersmurf]

Quote from Adventurer's Vault:
Urgrosh; +2 proficiency; d12/d8 damage; 30 gp; 12 lb.; Group: Axe, spear; Properties: Defensive, off-hand

Hmm. So I assume if a Ranger has Weapon Focus (Spear) and uses Twin Strike, he only gets to add his damage to the 1d8 end, not to the 1d12 end?

-Hyp.

 

[Kordeth]

Hmm. So I assume if a Ranger has Weapon Focus (Spear) and uses Twin Strike, he only gets to add his damage to the 1d8 end, not to the 1d12 end?

-Hyp.

Nope. Per the rules, if a weapon has multiple types, you get the full benefit of any effect that works with any of those types. There's nothing in the description of double weapons on p. 10 of Adventurer's Vault to contradict that, so if you're proficient with spears you're proficient with an Urgrosh, and if you have Weapon Focus (spear) you get a +2 to damage with any Urgrosh attack.

 

[Cadfan]

I don't know why this is surprising when the 3e dwarf had proficiency with special axes.

 

[Hypersmurf]

There's nothing in the description of double weapons on p. 10 of Adventurer's Vault to contradict that...

Ah. The "I assume" above was the assumption that there would be

-Hyp.

 

[Gloombunny]

In situations like these I find it unproductive to worry whether or not it's intended to work a certain way and prefer to just look at whether or not it should work a certain way.

Eladrin is not a great race for any spear-wielding class, so I say go ahead and give them a free superior proficiency; it'll make them more balanced, not less.

Dwarves are pretty good at certain melee classes already, but I don't think it would break anything to let them to have a superior proficiency too. I mean it just saves them one feat. Not really a big deal.

 

[SadisticFishing]

Well, for one thing, one of the major reasons to play a human is one free feat. So it is a pretty big deal.

Dwarves are basically the best, most all around useable race in the PHB before this!

But honestly, it makes sense, and it's cool. I have no problem with it, and it's 100% how it's worded.

 

[Stalker0]

Dwarves are basically the best, most all around useable race in the PHB before this!

Dwarves are good for melee, but I wouldn't say the best. The dragonborn's +2 to str is a big big factor. And dragonborn get an extra attack every fight which is also useful.

If a dwarf takes their training feat and dragonborn takes weapon focus, they both get an effective +2 to damage. And of course teh dragonborn's feat gets better at higher tiers and he still has that critical +1 to attack rolls the dwarf does not.

The dwarf can now use better weapon, but the dragonborn can take another feat to get that. The dwarf has no feat to give him a +2 to str.

So I think the feat is fine as is, dragonborn fight with raw power, dwarves fight with skill and tradition.

 

[Majushi]

Dwarves are basically the best, most all around useable race in the PHB before this!

Dwarves are what now?

Dragonborn, my honest opinion, are by far the most usable race.

+2 Str / +2 Cha means that they can fit in almost all classes (barring Wizards mainly and possibly Warlock)

Inspiring Warlord, Brutal Rogue, TWF Ranger, Fighter, Fighting Cleric, Paladin

What does Dwarf have to offer other than Second Wind as a Minor Action? (yes, I know that is awesome. So is Dragonbreath)

 

[Minigiant]

I'd say Dragonborn are the must usefable class since each class can benfit somehow from Str, Cha, Boosted surges, or Dragonbreath.

Second is oddly Half elf because they multiclass well and +2 Con/Cha is good for most classes.
I'd put Dwarves tied with Humans for 3rd.