D&D 5E Eberron versus Multiverse

[generic]

Why is they always want to go faster than light. They should be bending space and not moving at all. Let the space do the work. It’s bendable and flexible. Alternatively we may just need to raise the speed of light. Get their fast, avoid the jelly, and problem solved.

As my grandfather said, let the tool do the work for you. It's far easier to literally bend and fracture the space-time continuum than it is to go really, really fast.

 

[tetrasodium]

And what I love about all these reasons that Eberron does not fit into planescape is exactly why it does fit into the planescape cosmology. And that is they are clueless. Lol. The exact thing a person from the prime would believe. A bunch of clueless berks that don’t get it.

Or... Magic is a science in eberron & the planescape books were written from the assumption of native to sigil or a cargocult interpretation of magic like FR/Greyhawk/etc... Lets call that FR/GH hailing immigrant Andy & put in an Eberron hailing immigrant Beth.

Andy gets to Sigil & meets people who have a far better understading of the universe & how magic itself fuctions than all but a tiny handful of eleminster types from his world. He is confused but occasionally useful at getting stuff done. Those who benefit from his services* might occasionally try to help educate him, but the chasm between what a normal person knows and what Andy knows is so great that all but the most basic concepts taught to pre & post-pubescent children quickly prove themselves to be beyond his capability so they eventually throw up their hands and declare "magic", "The gods are powerful worship them", or some other excuse that ensures Andy will bother someone else or return after gaining enough knowledge to almost understand "Beginners intro to scratching the surface on $topic"

An Eberron native who spent years attending school with what might be mildly enchanted books that help the reader understand their content & fit right in. Beth gets there & understands the magic as a science well enough for the quick 30 second box cover/back of the book explanations to be ample for her understanding & self guided instruction into topics that interest her. Maybe her services are also useful & she is able to engage in mutual cross education into esoteric topics.

One day Andy is leaving Beth's Local friend's place mumbling the names of gods & their portfolios while on the lift with Beth. Andy had just been told about the "Gods" by their mutual friend & Beth is intrigued bout the fact that Andy's mumblings seemed to suggest these were real verifiable individuals. Beth came to show off her Carousel Hazard construct to Dave because she'd talked about it several times with him & he always seemed interested; but today Beth has finished building or commissioning the construct needed for play & has flasks with dozens of different drinks loaded in it. Over the course of the game, Beth mentions the weird guy she met in the elevator & how she tried to explain the construct to him but eventually gave up & simply declared "It's a magic game". Dave bawls with laughter & nearly falls out of his seat while describing Andy & how he gave up explaining just minutes before she had arrived with a "they are gods" explanation. Both of them laugh & agree that those poor souls who bound themselves to planar energies & eldritch machines to serve the needs of security & the like at the expense of some free will deserve respects & all, but it's not like nobody understands the process of divine ranks so Beth cackles as Dave loses a hand only to have the construct dispense a flask of Zil Absynthe to him... She knows the game is hers.


You can cargo cult down science, you can't science cargocult

* Lets call this guy Dave

 

[Arnwolf666]

This is why planescape is garbage drivel seemingly written for the enjoyment of tryhards who can’t feel good about themselves without taking a dump on someone else.

i think David Zeb Cook may be the best game designer of all time along with Jeff Grubb. Both were just brilliant men imho that really knew what they were doing. And Grubb could integrate the mechanics of anything brilliantly between any system with simple elegance.

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

That's... a leap. It is impossible in canon. So, we have no basis for saying what they'd be like if they did get there. This is akin to asking what the experience of traveling faster than light is like - it is a question that cannot be answered.

I seem to remember that FR gods derive their power from worshippers and that their realm of influence is delimited by Ao. Besides, they are supposed to be powerless outside of their crystal sphere. So I postulated that the combined effect of their "home rules" precluding them from having power and the "local rules" blocking them off would make very difficult from them to manifest power. But you're right it's a guess.

 

[Arnwolf666]

I seem to remember that FR gods derive their power from worshippers and that their realm of influence is delimited by Ao. Besides, they are supposed to be powerless outside of their crystal sphere. So I postulated that the combined effect of their "home rules" precluding them from having power and the "local rules" blocking them off would make very difficult from them to manifest power. But you're right it's a guess.

Well almost. Some gods exist in multiple crystal
Spheres. Tiamat, asmodeus, moradin to name just a few.

 

[jayoungr]

Unfortunately, Eberron is explicitly "part of the Great Wheel of the multiverse".

Serious question, because I honestly don't get the problem: what effect does this have on your game?

 

[Arnwolf666]

Serious question, because I honestly don't get the problem: what effect does this have on your game?

Someone might play the game wrong.

 

[Parmandur]

Something that's bugging me, and I don't mean it as (purely) a personal attack, but:

A lot of your posts are kind of stating the obvious, what we all know whether implicitly or explicitly.

For a lot of us when it comes to varying issues, our problem with what is and isn't isn't "what" but "why" and "should it be so". So when you come out and reiterate what is plain to see, it sounds like you're implicitly defending the status quo and giving WotC carte blanche to do whatever with no room for criticism. Is that your intent?

Sometimes the obvious needs to be stated. Now, do I like the current D&D status quo? Yes, very much so. Do I think it is best it continues? Yes, I do.

The post you quote was answering the "why" question, however. The "why" to including Eberron in the Great Wheel is IP branding purposes, though they do a good job in allowing for other possibilities.

 

[Parmandur]

Neither do I. I'll take the risk of doing a real-world analogy, which can be touchy when speaking of religion, but being an atheist, I think there is no god. When I say that, I imply "in our universe". If, when the bing bang started, another bubble universe was created at the same time, with which we cannot interact (and which can't interact with our universe), and a godlike being took charge of "his" universe, my real-life worldview wouldn't be invalidated, because its existence would be improvable and be functionnaly meaningless in our reality.

Well, do note that we can't get too far on the weeds here due to board rules (no politics, no religion), but I will say that you are right in your point here, though I come from the exact opposite point of view regarding the reality of our world.

 

[Umbran]

I seem to remember that FR gods derive their power from worshippers and that their realm of influence is delimited by Ao. Besides, they are supposed to be powerless outside of their crystal sphere.

Isn't Ao himself specifically an overgod of Aber-Toril? And, some deities (like, say, Corellon Larethian) are present in several worlds.

And, if I recall correctly, "worshipers = power" is not true for all worlds - Greyhawk, if I recall correctly, does not operate by that rule. Someone please correct me if that's inaccurate.

So, yes, maybe gods that are specific to and found only in the Realms would be powerless by Ao's rule, but that doesn't generalize to other gods.

It doesn't help that consistent cosmology has been D&D's strong suit. Nor has consistent views of getting from one Prime Material world to another, or the relationship of those worlds. In some variations on the cosmology, each world is its own Prime Material Plane, while Spelljammer would have it be that there's one Prime Material plane, with each world within it in a sphere...

Wibbly-wobbly, timey-wimey nonsense.