Epic D&D campaign (still recruiting)

well if you do, that should make you by far the Highest DPS in the party outside of my alpha-strike. (Heck, if you do it right you'll beat that too)
I'd suggest dropping the Greater MWF if you plan on power attacking, the lower-end iterative attacks aren't gonna be hitting on anything but a 20 at that point, and if you're leap-attack pouncing at 3 or 4X damage, then things you CAN hit will be dead before you get that many attacks off anyways. It's very much a one-turn one-kill build at that point.

Anyways, Off to work we go, back in ~10 hours.
 
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I'm just going to bow out. We have Omega an ancient relic warlock, you sorcerer of some stripe, a maralith, and a vampire swordsage. No matter what I would be stepping on someone's toes.
 

well if you do, that should make you by far the Highest DPS in the party outside of my alpha-strike. (Heck, if you do it right you'll beat that too)
I'd suggest dropping the Greater MWF if you plan on power attacking, the lower-end iterative attacks aren't gonna be hitting on anything but a 20 at that point, and if you're leap-attack pouncing at 3 or 4X damage, then things you CAN hit will be dead before you get that many attacks off anyways. It's very much a one-turn one-kill build at that point.

It all hinges on Pounce, though. Unless there is some bonus to str or PA damage to wielding a weapon in six hands. I'm guessing not.

I'm just going to bow out. We have Omega an ancient relic warlock, you sorcerer of some stripe, a maralith, and a vampire swordsage. No matter what I would be stepping on someone's toes.


My character doesn't even have toes, so no risk there. ;)
 

rangerjohn: First off, if yo uwant to bow out thats fine, but I do believe your worry about stepping on people's toes is unfounded. So far every character posted has been radically different, and theres still alot of wiggle room.

As for the pro archmage comment, I do take slight offense to that (not that I believe any was intended mind you). At this level, no matter which rendition of shapechange you use, it can make you better BY FAR than any of the current posted characters here. And the trajic part is there is no controling factors to it. I can't see how far off your stats will go because you get to pick something new each time you cast it, hell each round you are in it! I don't remove shapechange for me, I remove it so that every character who doesn't have it gets to play.

Nephtys: I'm really hoping it doesn't feel like I'm picking on you. Its not my intention and 90% of your character is going well. BUT, I am going to disallow the barbarian alternate class feature. I've always despised that ability. They weren't thinking straight when they made it. 1 level to get unlimited pounce is WAY too cheap for such a powerful ability, and if you took it you would overmatch every non-spell flinger in the party unless they all went back and took it too. Same problem as the shapechange.

Jemal: Putting up a consolidated house rules list is on my things to do list, which means god knows when its gonna show up. Been too busy with off-line life recently. Honestly the Rogues Gallery is next on my list. Hopefully tommorow, but it IS mothersday so it might be monday.
 

For Neph's character, I wonder if there may be a point of compromise?

What if Neph downgraded the marilith's natural abilities somewhat...enough to bump the LA to +9. Then you can get another level of something, giving you access to epic feats.

Then you can get Dire Charge, which is kind of like Pounce, but a squidge more limited. It gives you some of the functionality without that abusability that has our GM concerned.

As far as what would need to be sacrificed to get the ECL to +9...well, that's something you'd need to discuss.
 

The problem is I don't see a niche that hasn't been filled. My original idea now that I've finally been able to read TOB is amazingly close to the swordsage. Heck he was even an elf in life.

Going the other way we have Jemal's sorcerer and Shayuri's warlock. Or if I were to go more warrior, we run into the maralith. What am I missing?
 
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Without the ability to do a full attack from feats or scrolls (Q Ddoor) or class features I gain nothing from the main feature of the Marilith since six arms are no better than two against an intelligent opponent who keeps mobile. As it is I get an extra move action 3/day from an item, other than that it's one attack per round possible most of the time. Against the ACs in the ELH I'm not likely to hit with my single attack unless I can use touch attacks I gain from wands or scrolls.

Maybe it's true that the character would be more powerful than the other non-casters in the party, but it would never have the power or versatility of the casters. If "overpowered" abilities geared for non-casters are not allowed and if we are not allowed to compensate for their relative inflexibility with crafted items that cast or duplicate the spells that casters can use with few restrictions there is no way we will even come close to the power of the inherently overpowered casters. I understand that you're requesting the spellcasters players not to use Shapechange, and that is a good request. It keeps the spellcasters being spellcasters and not melee monsters. In the same way it is reasonable to keep the fighters from stepping on the casters toes by using crafted items and scrolls. But reducing a fighting character to using one attack per round (against an opponent with half a brain), while spellcasters have near unlimited power and flexibility (with a request not to use Shapechange), is not balanced.

It's your right to disallow whatever you want. And I certainly understand that you won't allow anything that could be against the rules. It is your game and I respect that. I'm sorry if my frustration comes off as offensive to you. Your task is more difficult tham mine. But creating this character has taken a lot of time and effort for me and I can't get it to work. It's disheartening.
 
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Neph - Don't forget Quickened SLA: Teleport, that'll do the same trick (And just FYI, quickened D-Door as you suggested would NOT, as you loose all other actions after you dimension door). Sure the quickened Teleport doesn't allow you the charge bonuses, but they still allow you the extra attacks.

Shayuri's idea seems an interesting solution, as well. Along with Quickened Greater Teleport 3/day and belt of battle 3/day, that would give you one guaranted full-round per combat (Assuming you either charge during the first round, or convince the DM to change it to the more common and sensical 'once per combat' house rule rather than "in the first round") and 6 more expendable per day.

Assuming 3 combats per day, that would be 3 times per combat that you could assault your opponent from further than your reach. Speaking of which, don't forget Marilith's have 10' reach, so people can't just walk away, they HAVE to tumble to get out of your range without provoking an AoO, which limits what they can do, AND they have to end up more than 15' from you(To prevent you from simply 5 foot stepping). And if they're powerful enough that you HAVE to full round them (IE not minions) then they'll likely be outnumbered, and the manuevering advantage belongs to the side with the greater number of pieces.

Also, keep in mind that any Opponent who's a melee fighter (one not focused on mobility such as a dervish or scout) would also want to Full-Round, it's kinda they way melee classes work unless you specifically build the character otherwise. A mage or ranged character is going to try to get away from ANY melee that attacks them, so you're essentially trying to argue that melee is pointless at Epic (Which I can guarantee you from experience is far from true)


I just don't see a lot of badguys repeatedly running away from you on every turn, and even if they do, they would have to run away from you successfully four times in a row before it would even START to become an issue (Using my assumptions above about dire charge/belt of battle/quickened teleport and 3 encounters per day) Even at SIX encounters per day (Which is way more than I would expect at this level), you could still do it twice per encounter, meaning they'd have to run on three concurrent turns. Personally, I'd go with One big weapon and four little weapons as your 'off-hand attacks'. (IE Greatsword/4XShortsword or some such). That way you have the one Two-hander for a single big bash when you can't full round, and you could view the MWF capabilities as the icing on the cake for the 2-3 rounds(guaranteed) per combat that you DO get them.
 

Rangerjohn:
here's a list of Common archetypes we do not have:
Combat Priest
Healing Priest
Spellcasting Priest
Shapechanger (Druid or transmuter mage)
Controller
Ranged Fighter Type(Archer, dagger thrower, etc)
Mascot (monstrous non-humanoid character. No, Marilith doesn't count)
Fighter-Mage (Wasn't that your original idea? Why doesn't it work?).

Also, there are dozens of different variations on most types. Especially melee fighters.

So as you can see, there are a lot of toes around. Dont' gotta worry that it'll be ours you step on.

Also, I believe we are doing split parties, so that also removes the toes of whomever is in the other party.


EDIT: Vertexx - I was going over everyones sheets to see what roles had been filled, and noticed your obscene hide check.. How'd you get a +47 misc and then another situational +40 on top of that? (I assume that's what the +47(+87) = +72(+112) means). In fact a lot of your stuff has really high mods, I'd be interested to know where they came from, as I've been looking for ways to shore up my skills what with not being able to make skill-items via the chart.
 
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Oops was off by one (Max hide modifier of 1d20+111) 10D/-2ACP/8R/30C: The mantle of great stealth (ELH) takes care of most of it with a lovely +30 Comp mod. As a vampire Hanshu gets +8 racial mods to 8 skills, hide among them. For the situational +40, that's from my lovely ring of sequestering that makes Hanshu invisible (a +40 if not moving or a +20 if he is to hide checks), without being susceptible to those pesky divination spells like "see invisibility/true seeing", or konk out when I attack. Coupled with his darkstalker feat from the book of aberrations, scentblinder and flight, Hanshu really is invisible to every form of detection unless an enemy can beat his obscene hide check.

Luckily there are 2 epic items that give the good, epic lvl bonuses to skills and I bought them both. Jump being based off both strength and speed is easy to get huge bonuses for. I'm just getting the most out if it with tiger claw maneuvers
 

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