Fire Sheild

[Markn]

I would like to hear what other people think of the Fire Shield spell. This spell has become a major force in the current campaign that I am running and it significantly reduces the threat that a lot of fights pose. In some cases, the fire/cold damage done to the attacking creature is more than what the attacking creature is capable of doing and if you combine that with creatures that are vulnerable to cold/fire the creature is no match for this spell. Furthermore, creatures with weak attacks but with many (as in 2-4 attacks on their turn) are obliterating themselves moreso than the PC. It just seems too effective....

I am well aware I can change encounters and stuff but I don't think that is the answer and we really use the intelligence of creatures during combat. If they have low intelligence they may flee, continue attacking that same person or attack other people while intelligent enemies will adjust their tactics accordingly so they are the most effective. However, there are still times (and quite often too) that this spell so effectively controls combat. Thoughts?

 

[Thanee]

Did they never hear of range weapons?

Or just attack the unprotected party members.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Markn]

Can't use ranged weapons all the time....

I do use that when I can. However, the current campaign is the Adventure Path from the Dungeon magazine. It really is a spectacular campaign but there are a lot of animals, beasts, magical beasts and so forth. They don't have the option of pulling out their bows. Nor do npc fighters that have powerful (or at least more powerful) melee weapons. Soon, legions fire shield will be available and then the whole party will be protected. All in all it just seems like a powerful spell that can really hose npc's....

 

[Diirk]

Legion's Fire Shield ? Where's that from? You might want to disallow that.. fire shield isn't too bad because the only people that can have it are either fairly weak (wizards/sorcerors) or not as common (clerics with the fire domain)... fire shielded fighters/barbarians wouldn't be nice tho.

 

[Sir ThornCrest]

damage per strike or damage per round? I dont have book with me

If you got a creature with multiple attacks, lets say a lion anywhere between 1 to 5 attacks per round. He comes in gets burned, doesnt understand it, backs up and will probably keep his distance run away or maybe go for one more attack. Either way the animal int creatures will in most cases bail the scene. A smart one may come in do his attacks, feel the burn and jump away to rethink his stratagem. Non int will probably not detect you as an enemy or will attack untill you or they are dead and being eatin. Extremly int will see your shield for what it is and devise your demise from afar untill they have the upper hand, and then strike.

just some basics
thorncrest

I would like to hear what other people think of the Fire Shield spell. This spell has become a major force in the current campaign that I am running and it significantly reduces the threat that a lot of fights pose. In some cases, the fire/cold damage done to the attacking creature is more than what the attacking creature is capable of doing and if you combine that with creatures that are vulnerable to cold/fire the creature is no match for this spell. Furthermore, creatures with weak attacks but with many (as in 2-4 attacks on their turn) are obliterating themselves moreso than the PC. It just seems too effective....

I am well aware I can change encounters and stuff but I don't think that is the answer and we really use the intelligence of creatures during combat. If they have low intelligence they may flee, continue attacking that same person or attack other people while intelligent enemies will adjust their tactics accordingly so they are the most effective. However, there are still times (and quite often too) that this spell so effectively controls combat. Thoughts?

 

[Markn]

Interesting....

PS - I am at work right now so I don't have a PHB...

Legions Fire Shield I believe is from the Miniature's Handbook. I am definately looking at not allowing that. I just did a check on the 3.5srd for fire shield and I see that the target it 'You'. Can anyone confirm that this is what is in the PHB? If so, that is an error we have been making and thus the spell is used to protect a wizard type which then makes a heck of a lot more sense. We have been using it on fighters and that is really, really nasty!

 

[Egres]

Can anyone confirm that this is what is in the PHB?

Confirmed.

 

[Sir ThornCrest]

cont about fire shield

I get so many calls in the office its hard for me to keep a train of thought. Anyways back to the spell. So the tactics of the encounter will change if the fire shield is noticed. How many hit pionts does the person casting it have? If and when the attacker hurts him its a -from his concentration, he may be unable to cast spells because he is putting himself in harms way. He may get nickled and dimed to death literrally,! Doesnt the spell only trigger on hits? Not on attempted attacks?
Thorncrest

I would like to hear what other people think of the Fire Shield spell. This spell has become a major force in the current campaign that I am running and it significantly reduces the threat that a lot of fights pose. In some cases, the fire/cold damage done to the attacking creature is more than what the attacking creature is capable of doing and if you combine that with creatures that are vulnerable to cold/fire the creature is no match for this spell. Furthermore, creatures with weak attacks but with many (as in 2-4 attacks on their turn) are obliterating themselves moreso than the PC. It just seems too effective....

I am well aware I can change encounters and stuff but I don't think that is the answer and we really use the intelligence of creatures during combat. If they have low intelligence they may flee, continue attacking that same person or attack other people while intelligent enemies will adjust their tactics accordingly so they are the most effective. However, there are still times (and quite often too) that this spell so effectively controls combat. Thoughts?

 

[Diirk]

Was 3.0 fire shield different? Legion's looks overly powerful compared to 3.5 fire shield... its 1 level higher and affects the entire party instead of just the caster.... ?!!?!

And yeah, personal only is one of the limiting factors of the spell (altho martial clerics with fire or sun domains can still do some pretty nasty things with it).

 

[Markn]

3.0 Fire Shield

Diirk,

We never used 3.0 Fire Shield nor do I remember how it worked. It's funny, how a group of people can get a mental block and assume a spell works a specific way when in reality its not as unbalanced as it seems and is limited by casintg it only upon yourself. As for Legions, yeah, it's sick when an entire party can be protected like that. Essentially the bad guys have no choice but to run or die a horrible fiery death.

Sir Thorncrest,

Believe me, we take all those things into account. Circumstances can play a big part too! If the players are in a beasts lair the creature is going to defend it's home to death most likely. Especially if he is blocked in. One scenario a few weeks back involved a cryohydra attacking a warmage with the fire shield on. The war mage single handedly killed it because the beast damn near killed himself with his own attacks (and yes it requires a successful hit to trigger the damage back to the attacker). Then on the warmage's turn he used a spell and finished the creature off...Having said all that the encounter was kind of exciting as the player wasn't sure who would die first and the warmage had 1hp left when the cryohydra died. The dissapointing thing was that it happend in about 2 round. Kind of anit climactic.