Forsaker... worst PrC ever??

[ThomasBJJ]

Is it just me, or does this Prestige Class make absolutely no sense? How is the character gaining all these abilities??? The certainly aren't magical, the char. has given up magic. What about all the townsfolk who never will own a magic item. Can they all become Forsakers too?
I have no problem with wierd prestige classes, just explain why the character is getting these abilities. There is no campaign way of explaining this.

 

[Duganson]

Elementary, my dear...

Thomas,
The reason that the Farsaker gains all those ability bonuses is becuase the Challenge Rating System relies on the fact that characters have magic items that add to ability scores. Damage reduction and the ability to hit as unarmed even with a weapon is there becuase the Farsaker doesn't have weapon enchantments. Spell Resistence seemed a bit much, but I haven't play tested it, so we'll see. In roleplaying terms the average NPC is not likely to throw away 3 feats and get into spell battles to gain this prestige class (if your DM does that then you'd better find a new group, ouch!)
As the PrC goes I like it. The forsaker is a change from the usual hum-drum that the class books became. Personaly I would play it with a Monk, not a Ranger or Barbarian, but thats me.

Thysl in Silver

 

[Wippit Guud]

Why does everything have to be either 'magical' or 'non magical'?
We have psionics... nothing says they can't become Forsakers (and wouldn't THAT be sick?)

Where do troll get their regeration? Where do displacer beasts get their displacement. Nother of those are considered spells, couldn't a Forsaker tap into the same power that they do?

Real-life parallel - how did that 120 lbs woman lift a car?

 

[Werdnam]

Me, I like this PrC, even though it looks like it lays the special abilities on a bit thick. It reminds me of the "old" (1e?) barbarian, who couldn't even adventure with a magic-user until he got to a certain level.

Plus, all those special abilities are necessary to make it playable. I once played a 2e ranger who decided, as a point of pride, to never use magic, nor to accept magical aid. I quickly realized this was not a viable character concept.

 

[Chun-tzu]

We have psionics... nothing says they can't become Forsakers (and wouldn't THAT be sick?)

No, actually they did account for psionics. Psionics in 3E are officially spell-like abilities, which the Forsaker must renounce.

 

[Little_Buddha]

No, actually they did account for psionics. Psionics in 3E are officially spell-like abilities, which the Forsaker must renounce.

Don't think so... psionics are offically either Psionics or Magic, depending on whether you use the optional 'Psionics Are Identical To Magic' rule... Got a reference for that notion?

The real problem I have with the Forsaker class is the fact that the only way to get that DR at opportune times is to carry around magic items, rather than destroying them. That makes NO sense, but otherwise you're powering up your DR at the end of each adventure, once you've looted the main bad guy - and after the point were DR would have been useful.

 

[Axiomatic Unicorn]

PsiH page 4.

"The default rule allows magic and psionics to work with and against each other, but OPTIONAL rules for making psionics and magic different are also provided."

I don't think the Forsaker PClass should be obligated to specify how it changes for every optional rule that may be used.

 

[Chun-tzu]

Don't think so... psionics are offically either Psionics or Magic, depending on whether you use the optional 'Psionics Are Identical To Magic' rule... Got a reference for that notion?

Psionic Handbook, page 35, under Concentration, second paragraph.

"Psionics are spell-like abilities."

 

[EOL]

There seems to be two questions:

1- Is the Forsaker broken or over-powered?

I would say absolutely not when you consider what he's giving up. I think if you did some sample battles between a forsaker and a PC with average magical equipment I have no doubt that the Forsaker would lose just as often as he won.

2- Where do the powers of the prestige class come from?

Does it matter? And if it does, come on man you're a role-player be creative make something up. Post-modern thought is always talking about the space between, a void of meaning. Why can't there be a void of magic, something along the lines of a lovecraftian horror. It would have it's own power and it would derive entirely from the absence of magic. There! One possible explanation, out of hundreds I'm sure, for the source of the Forsakers ability.

 

[omedon]

Psionics are considered spell-like abilities. And this applies whether or not you use the psionics are different rule.