Good Superhero-Game?

[Seeten]

M&M models everything from Arthur to Galactus to Beyonder and everything in between. There is NO concept I can't model.

Further, you dont need 400 points of disads on your sheet to play M&M, my characters typically have 0.

 

[kigmatzomat]

I like HERO as a concept (I like detail heavy games like Heavy Gear & Mechwarrior) but trying to teach it to players....ack! The game mechanics themselves aren't so bad but the creation is like pulling teeth. I've got two players who still get hung up creating 1st level d20 characters!

CNM and other well-implemented Fuzion games seemed like a best of all worlds to me; a reasonable amount of granularity (meaning "does not overwhelm new players"), straightforward character creation, reasonable mechanics. YMMV.

 

[Donovan Morningfire]

I like HERO as a concept (I like detail heavy games like Heavy Gear & Mechwarrior) but trying to teach it to players....ack! The game mechanics themselves aren't so bad but the creation is like pulling teeth. I've got two players who still get hung up creating 1st level d20 characters!

CNM and other well-implemented Fuzion games seemed like a best of all worlds to me; a reasonable amount of granularity (meaning "does not overwhelm new players"), straightforward character creation, reasonable mechanics. YMMV.

Those who know me IRL know that I've been a long-time vocal proponent of HERO as the Super Hero RPG.

Two of the big reasons I've switched to M&M is for for the exact same reasons you listed. It's easy to pick up, especially if a player has at least a passing familiarity with the d20 mechanic, and character creation doesn't require either a scientific calculator or an advanced mathematics degree

 

[mcrow]

Our group tried Hero once. We have one member of the group that has been a longtime fan and player of Hero so he ran the game. We sat down to generate characters and about an 1 1/2 in we just told him to bring some pregens next week because none of us was dig'n it. When we played it the next week we had a combat encounter that lasted pretty much the whole session. Combat was waaaaaaaay to long, even considering we had not played much Hero. The system is overly complicated.

I have found that there is nothing someone can make in Hero that you can't get out of M&M. Even the Hero fan in our group is now converting to M&M because it is much more simple and he can de everything with it that he could do with Hero.

 

[Fishbone]

The Tick is tricky. Who is he hunted by? Is Arthur a disadvantage, a Follower who must be bought with points, a completely seperate character. How much damage reduction? Is it armor? How do you replicate the building jumping?
Tahngarth is a badass minotaur from Magic:The Gathering.
Swamp Thing is friggin' hard. Magical yams, one with the green, all sorts of powers on him.
The luck ability is hard to replicate.
Making a character in HERO is not that hard. Combat should never take that long. I don't understand how combats last so long for people in HERO.

 

[Seeten]

The Tick is easy. M&M doesnt care whether its armor, skin, force fields, the saves all mean the same thing. Arthur would be up to the players, but I'd call him a sidekick. Give him "Jumping: Limited to buildings"

Swamp Thing can use a variable power pool, like Magic, to purchase all his effects as alternate powers of "One with the Green" including teleport(limited, through green), regeneration(Limited, touching green only) etc. Absolutely not difficult to model. In fact, all the DC characters are already done in a pdf.

Anyone who claims powers cannot be modelled in M&M just has never looked at the book. Its clear to me that people who love Hero have never so much as looked at M&M, because its power gen system is fullbore, and it can do anything. I am fine with people having specific complaints(which I am fairly sure I can dispel) but making up stuff about a system you've never read is not necessary.

I've made characters for Champions, and I've made characters for M&M, and M&M is both easier, and more robust. It also doesnt require a scientific calculator, or 200 points of disadvantages, like Champions does, and from the sounds of it, like Hero does.

Mutants and Masterminds is incredible. Its a better use of d20 than D&D if you ask me.

Also, yes, I'm a fanboy.

 

[mcrow]

The Tick is easy. M&M doesnt care whether its armor, skin, force fields, the saves all mean the same thing. Arthur would be up to the players, but I'd call him a sidekick. Give him "Jumping: Limited to buildings"

Swamp Thing can use a variable power pool, like Magic, to purchase all his effects as alternate powers of "One with the Green" including teleport(limited, through green), regeneration(Limited, touching green only) etc. Absolutely not difficult to model. In fact, all the DC characters are already done in a pdf.

Anyone who claims powers cannot be modelled in M&M just has never looked at the book. Its clear to me that people who love Hero have never so much as looked at M&M, because its power gen system is fullbore, and it can do anything. I am fine with people having specific complaints(which I am fairly sure I can dispel) but making up stuff about a system you've never read is not necessary.

I've made characters for Champions, and I've made characters for M&M, and M&M is both easier, and more robust. It also doesnt require a scientific calculator, or 200 points of disadvantages, like Champions does, and from the sounds of it, like Hero does.

Mutants and Masterminds is incredible. Its a better use of d20 than D&D if you ask me.

Also, yes, I'm a fanboy.

I mostly agree.

M&M is no question the best game under the OGL, better than D&D, better than D20 Modern, and better than anything else that is OGL.

M&M is the best (overall) Supers RPG.

It can model anything HERO can, and does it in a much more simple way. The system is easy to teach to anyone whether they are familiar with d20 or not.

This doesn't even take into account how great the book looks.

at the moment M&M rules the supers roost.

and no I'm not a GR or M&M Fanboy, it is just that good.

 

[Fishbone]

I'm most certainly a HERO fanboy. I didn't say M&M wasn't robust, I just said that it is damn hard using some other systems, especially class based systems, which I don't like that much, to replicate known characters and that HERO does a superb job of it. If you don't like disads just give more base points, make them cost more, or be more inventive with the ones you take or allow. Christ, it isn't that big a deal. I like disadvantages a lot and think they are mechanically sound and a good idea.
Quote by me
" Its better and easier for emulating known heroes than just about anything else on the market, especially the class based d20 stuff that is dominating the market."
So do systems like HERO, GURPS, and yes, Mutants and Masterminds do a better job of replicating known characters than class-based d20 systems? Yeah, they certainly do.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Anyone who claims powers cannot be modelled in M&M just has never looked at the book. Its clear to me that people who love Hero have never so much as looked at M&M, because its power gen system is fullbore, and it can do anything.

I don't agree. M&M is my second favorite system of all time...right behind the HERO line.

IME, M&M has 90% of the flexibility of HERO, and to its credit, is much easier to learn to play. However, I don't think all of its powers are properly balanced, and I have had occasional problems doing PC conversions where M&M just doesn't quite result in a truly equivalent PC. Additionally, M&M doesn't really model the "Mad-Dog Killer" archetype as easily due to its emphasis on a "PG" cinematic style of combat, wheras HERO can go from "G" to "X" (in terms of violence) quite easily.

That's NOT an indictment of the system, just an observation.

 

[Felon]

I would highly reccomend newbies and disgruntled veterans to check out Sidekick, a 126pp distillation of the current HERO rules. It boils HERO down to the basics for easy digestion, and also leaves out many of the fiddly bits veterans may have come to dislike.

You're a good egg, Buzz. Just thought somebody ought to tell you that.