D&D 5E Hoard of the Dragon Queen - a solid D effort.

[bryce0lynch]

I don't have the adventure yet but I'm curious about this... is it that no matter what he can't be killed or that he is such a high level that there's almost no chance he can be killed?

Both.

He's very tough. And if you do manage to kill him then his minions drag him off and save him, so he can reappear in episode 3. His appearance in episode 3 is meaningless; it accomplishes nothing and impacts nothing. The railroad doesn't even have a purpose.

 

[Imaro]

Both.

He's very tough. And if you do manage to kill him then his minions drag him off and save him, so he can reappear in episode 3. His appearance in episode 3 is meaningless; it accomplishes nothing and impacts nothing. The railroad doesn't even have a purpose.

Ah, I see... hmm I think I'd be ok if he wasn't plot protected but was such a high level that there was only a slim chance he could be defeated... and then notes on how to substitute if he was killed by the PC's...

 

[keterys]

To be fair, since this is Encounters, it may be more "A vast majority of tables will not defeat him, so he should still be alive for future tables of (random PCs), so he is"

 

[evilbob]

Looking around online, this is one of the only actual reviews I can even find. Everything else I've seen looks to be a very generic overview written by someone who started writing minutes after they got the book, and they are positive in a generic way with no real details on what is good or useful. No one else has written a review with this much detail and examination so far. Thanks again.

 

[Astrosicebear]

First, a big shout out to bryce0lynch, his review sparked a collaborative effort rarely seen these days. So many want this to be good, instead of just lambasting it as a horrible product. It seems there are some redeeming qualities to the book, which I agree with. But I also agree with his critiques completely.

There are great people doing some awesome work (as posted on enworld.org's main page) on how to properly fix/run this book. And therein lies the true issue. This isnt a DM's sandbox kit... or a product meant for experienced DMs, or as Bryce put it, a 2E style kit. This is a product that at its core is nothing more than a compilation of the D&D Encounters, and thats my biggest gripe.

I bought a product I thought was intended as the premier 5th Edition Adventure Path... what I got was a product that didnt know what it wanted to be, and ended up being a series of free-to-play episodes (with free-to-play level of detail and time put in) jammed into a pretty hardcover.

I'll run it, with alot of the changes and fixes that the great internets have devised, and with a hand that a seasoned DM can bring to the table... but thats just so my players wont walk away from the table disgusted with 5E.

TL;DR if there was a competing product I'd chose that one. If you are brand new to 5E and your players are too...get the Starter Set (use the PHB for a much more robust experience) and run Lost Mines of Phandelvar... its a far superior experience.

 

[Agglomérante]

There are great people doing some awesome work (as posted on enworld.org's main page) on how to properly fix/run this book.

I've found the lovely Greenest encounter generator over at Detect Magic, but what else is available?

I haven't DMed in years and years and could use any fixes the community's devised! I'm so rusty

edit: this blog post has a nice roundup of HDQ ideas

Thanks!

 

[SilverBulletKY]

My characters are in Phandelin and once they finish up the start box adventure, I think I'm going to start out the Hoard of the Dragon Queen as the dragon and cultists are attacking Phandelin instead of Greenist. It would keep from having to explain why they traveled so far to Greenist and since they will find cultists later in Thundertree, they already know they're around.

 

[Astrosicebear]

I've found the lovely Greenest encounter generator over at Detect Magic, but what else is available?

I haven't DMed in years and years and could use any fixes the community's devised! I'm so rusty

Thanks!

http://hackslashmaster.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Hoard%20of%20the%20Dragon%20Queen

 

[Nebulous]

I'll run it, with alot of the changes and fixes that the great internets have devised, and with a hand that a seasoned DM can bring to the table... but thats just so my players wont walk away from the table disgusted with 5E.

TL;DR if there was a competing product I'd chose that one. If you are brand new to 5E and your players are too...get the Starter Set (use the PHB for a much more robust experience) and run Lost Mines of Phandelvar... its a far superior experience.

I think Phandelver is better too. I'm also a DCC fan, and the third party company Purple Sorcerer has some of the best short adventures i've read in a long time. Heck, i'd even consider running those with 5th edition. For all the time it would take to edit Hoard, i might as well import stats into a DCC game from 5e.

 

[the Jester]

To be fair, since this is Encounters, it may be more "A vast majority of tables will not defeat him, so he should still be alive for future tables of (random PCs), so he is"

This isnt a DM's sandbox kit... or a product meant for experienced DMs, or as Bryce put it, a 2E style kit. This is a product that at its core is nothing more than a compilation of the D&D Encounters, and thats my biggest gripe.

I've always felt that Encounters is a great way to introduce someone to a sort of D&D lite- which is to say, D&D without a lot of the things that make D&D great (the freedom to chose your path, consequences following your actions, etc). Making the first big 5e adventure a product for Encounters sort of automatically shoe-horns some of this into it. It's a shame; I was unlikely to buy an adventure set in the Realms in any case, but the Encounters-enabling limitations on the adventure (e.g. the dragon attack, the half-dragon duel, the lack of any real ability to change or influence the plot by pcs) certainly eliminates that small chance.

Basically, I feel (and pretty strongly) that designing an adventure to fit into the Encounters mold while still making a good adventure for home play is... challenging, at best. I haven't seen one yet, though I missed most of the Encounters stuff for the last year or so and have heard nothing but good about some of it. Yet it seems that the "come and go, follow the pre-arranged path so that you end up at the right section of the adventure next week" format that Encounters adventures almost have to follow is absolutely contrary to what I want out of a published adventure.

I think WotC would be well-served, in future, to make different adventures for Encounters than they plan to sell as actual adventures. It's possible to make a great Encounters adventure and it's possible to make a great home play adventure, but I don't know how feasible it is to make an adventure that's good for both without compromising all the things that can make either one GREAT.