D&D General Hot Take: D&D Has Not Recovered From 2E to 3.0 Transition

[Staffan]

To avoid the obvious PC-side power creep this idea otherwise produces, I'd suggest using the lower of those stat pairs for the save.

13th Age uses the middle of three stats for both AC, Physical Defense (~Fortitude/Reflex save), and Mental Defense (~Will save).

They also have most strong debuffs/crowd control spells based on the target's hit points, which means an enemy will be more susceptible to e.g. cause fear once you've knocked them around a bit.

 

[Horwath]

To avoid the obvious PC-side power creep this idea otherwise produces, I'd suggest using the lower of those stat pairs for the save.

That said, I still greatly prefer the 1e model, where the save is based on the source/type of thing you're saving against rather than on a stat.

I would use both, not lower or higher. That would still calculate in dump stat, but you would have 2 options to raise any specific save.

 

[fjw70]

"That's my secret, Cap. I'm always nostalgic for 4e."

It's just unfortunate that Wizards is still hamstringing the edition so we can't play it as easily as literally any other iteration of the game.
Can't get the core rules in print through DMs Guild.
Can't access character builders or other resources.
Can't run it on any VTT with any sort of functionally or automation.
Can't allow Retro Clones to use any of the system.

If I want to play 4e, there's no option other than to make characters with dice and pencils, playing with books found in swap meets.

You can more easily play 1974's OD&D than a system being enjoyed a decade ago.

They should ease up on the licensing.

 

[eyeheartawk]

And as always ban Kender.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Spell DC could also be 10+ ability modifier.

I like it... by removing prof you make it (on average) DCs 11-16. that means even a -1 doesn't ever have a 5% or less chance.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

They should ease up on the licensing.

they fear a piazo like retroclone will hurt there bottom line, don't expect them to open more stuff up.

 

[Zardnaar]

I like it... by removing prof you make it (on average) DCs 11-16. that means even a -1 doesn't ever have a 5% or less chance.

That was off the top of my head. If most saves don't scale though neither should DCs imho.

 

[Fanaelialae]

I like it... by removing prof you make it (on average) DCs 11-16. that means even a -1 doesn't ever have a 5% or less chance.

IMO, if you went that route, you'd need to do the same for saving throws (have it just based on the ability score sans proficiency).

Alternately, you could use the higher of the ability score or proficiency for both.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

IMO, if you went that route, you'd need to do the same for saving throws (have it just based on the ability score sans proficiency).

Alternately, you could use the higher of the ability score or proficiency for both.

why? if you get better at 1 or 2 of 6 how is that an issue? even 17th= level your best save is +6+5 for =+11

 

[Fanaelialae]

why? if you get better at 1 or 2 of 6 how is that an issue? even 17th= level your best save is +6+5 for =+11

You can be good at way more than 2/6. That's just what everyone gets. There's the feat that gives you an extra good save, as well as class features that do the same.

Moreover, if you're a paladin (or simply near a paladin) your bonus could be as high as a +16. There are other bonuses (ring of protection) that could push that even higher.