D&D (2024) How many of you would implement the drop to 0 HP, get 1 level of exhaustion house rule?

[AnotherGuy]

The big problem with the -1 to all rolls per level of exhaustion, which most people seem unable to process, is that it ruins martials and skill users, and has basically no effect on casters.

This is a major issue with 5e, casters make no roll for their spells. The game, in many ways, has compartmentalised mini-systems instead of recognising that casting is a skill, as is using a weapon, as is using your general skills and using tools.

 

[Horwath]

Yeah I think a big question is how easy is it to dump Exhaustion and what exactly does it do.


The big problem with the -1 to all rolls per level of exhaustion, which most people seem unable to process, is that it ruins martials and skill users, and has basically no effect on casters.

Like, martials - they have to roll to hit, and so this means they start missing a lot, their DPR and combat effectiveness plummet.

Skill users have to roll skills to act on the world, and so this means they start failing skill checks more and more, and become increasingly unable to impact the world or succeed at anything.

Casters though, retain close to 100% combat effectiveness. Their DPR and ability to control enemies doesn't go down - because they don't roll - enemies do. Basically only their own saves against enemy stuff are penalized - and I guess the few attack roll spells, but the only "caster" reliant on those is Warlock, who isn't a full caster.

Likewise, casters acting on the world through spells never have to make checks or rolls, the spells just succeed, so they can be on completely exhausted, and still able to function extremely well.

As such, this means exhaustion is a huge problem for martials/skill users, and not really a big problem for full casters. That's pretty crap.

Now if exhaustion caused you to lose spell slots, or to have to make a CON check to even cast a spell at all, perhaps that would start to make more sense.

that is why you add -1 AC(less effective HP) and -1 to all DCs(less powerful status effects)
add -5ft speed penalty per level and all aspects of the game are effected more or less the same.

 

[Horwath]

This is a major issue with 5e, casters make no roll for their spells. The game, in many ways, has compartmentalised mini-systems instead of recognising that casting is a skill, as is using a weapon, as is using your general skills and using tools.

that smells too much like 4E and we cannot have that here, haha!

 

[AnotherGuy]

that smells too much like 4E and we cannot have that here, haha!

Nah, it smells like VtM
Much better system!!! (major hint - use different dice)

 

[Ruin Explorer]

This is a major issue with 5e, casters make no role for their spells. The game, in many ways, has compartmentalised mini-systems instead of recognising that casting is a skill, as is using a weapon, as is using your general skills and using tools.

What's really sad is, mechanically, it would make just as much or more sense to actually make casters make rolls for spells in combat, rather than having enemies just make saves. 4E did it, and I would go as far as to say 5E only didn't do the same thing as a sop to people who thought "4E = BAD" and because of dumb D&D memes about saving throws. It generally even feels better from a player perspective.

It doesn't fit the generalized issue of casters never having to make any kind of check to affect the world, but that'll take a significantly braver edition than 5E ever was to deal with.

 

[Horwath]

What's really sad is, mechanically, it would make just as much or more sense to actually make casters make rolls for spells in combat, rather than having enemies just make saves. 4E did it, and I would go as far as to say 5E only didn't do the same thing as a sop to people who thought "4E = BAD" and because of dumb D&D memes about saving throws. It generally even feels better from a player perspective.

It doesn't fit the generalized issue of casters never having to make any kind of check to affect the world, but that'll take a significantly braver edition than 5E ever was to deal with.

active players makes all(or most) rolls is the best idea of 4E and I agree it was scrapped because of general vibe that 4E gives.

several good additions to D&D shipped in very bad packaging.

 

[Horwath]

Nah, it smells like VtM
Much better system!!! (major hint - use different dice)

worse thing in D&D is the d20 system that has a flaw of using the d20

worse thing in MtG is using the d10 the way it is used there.
somehow throwing 17+ dice is getting cumbersome.

1 dice for all rolls is to few, 10 is too many, maybe some middle ground of 3-5 dice is needed.

 

[AnotherGuy]

worse thing in D&D is the d20 system that has a flaw of using the d20

worse thing in MtG is using the d10 the way it is used there.
somehow throwing 17+ dice is getting cumbersome.

1 dice for all rolls is to few, 10 is too many, maybe some middle ground of 3-5 dice is needed.

You're on the right track.
I'm not ready to reveal my engine just yet, but should be done later this year.
I will be posting it on Enworld when I'm ready.

 

[Horwath]

You're on the right track.
I'm not ready to reveal my engine just yet, but should be done later this year.
I will be posting it on Enworld when I'm ready.

honestly, for rolling department, I really like AGE system.

all you need is 3d6

 

[Li Shenron]

Considering how bad the current exhaustion system can be, I don't think I'd want to include it as a punishment for hitting 0. Played in a game recently which had us get multiple levels of exhaustion and it was punishing.

It depends a lot on how frequently the PCs drop below 0hp.

I don't have consistent rules, the adventures I run aren't normally very deadly, unless they are one-shots where long-term penalties don't really matter, so I usually don't even establish or announce house rules for dying until it happens, and when it does I discuss with the dying PC's player if they want to let it die or agree on a penalty to continue.

A level of exhaustion would not be enough for my purpose when it happens so infrequently, but perhaps a persistent level of exhaustion would, maybe something they have to roll again each day to see if it goes away or not.

I am not a fan of the order of exhaustion levels though, I prefer to roll randomly instead of following the specific order, so you can be lucky or not but you aren't necessarily advantaged by your class. In any case, I prefer the variety of 5e exhaustion levels effects over cumulative -1 to all rolls.